Bonsai Study Group Forum

Species Specific => White Pine Bonsai Discussion => Topic started by: Adair M on March 01, 2014, 06:53 PM

Title: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 01, 2014, 06:53 PM
I know, i know: pics or it didn't happen...

I will post a couple of pics.

But first, let me say this... Owen Reich told me today I need to post more here. And I said I would, but its hard to post pictures. So... I tend to take pictures with my iPhone when I see a bonsai worth photographing, because I always have it with me. If this forum would allow me to attach photos directly from my phone, I would post them.

I bet I'm not alone in this. Or if I'm just a dummy, and it can be done, tell me how.

(Rant over)

 Last summer when Peter had just returned from Japan, I was lucky to be the right place at the right time to aquire a nice antique Chinese pot from him.  I didn't have a tree for it, so it's been patiently waiting...

Steve Cratty of Plant City Bonsai went on a buying trip and came upon a JWP recently wired and styled by Peter. He brought it back to Georgia, and when I saw it, I thought it would go well with my pot.

So, in the next post, I'll try to upload pictures. Because it did happen!
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 01, 2014, 07:22 PM
Ok, here's the photo.  (I hope!)
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Gaffer on March 01, 2014, 07:25 PM
I know the feeling. It's a little frustrating . Until I figure it out I mean sending in a photo.
Qualicum Brian
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: bwaynef on March 01, 2014, 09:03 PM
I'd really like this thread to focus on the nice tree that was posted, but I don't have any difficulty posting pictures with my iPhone, and I'm guessing John Kirby doesn't either (as evidenced by the sideways pictures that were posted and DonB posted about recently).  (For that matter, I'd imagine posting with my iPad is just as easy.)  I don't have time right now to write up the details, but I'll try to remember to do it later.)

Also, this forum has added the Tapatalk plugin, but the version of software isn't supported by that plugin for posting pictures from within Tapatalk. Its a known issue and one we're unable to correct at this time.  That said, loading the Safari browser and selecting images to attach from there yields images that are attached to threads.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: tmmason10 on March 01, 2014, 10:51 PM
Adair, I hope you share more photos too! I use an iPhone, you need a picture app that can save into a smaller file size to post here. I use an app called picshop but there's probably thousands of other ones that would work.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: John Kirby on March 02, 2014, 09:16 AM
iPad, iPhone no problem uploading or resizing, the site us doing that. The orientation of the pictures can be a bit of a crapshoot. So from iPad write your post, then choose file, take a new picture or choose one on tour camera, then post, voila! Here is an example from the iPad, no post  process.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: John Kirby on March 02, 2014, 09:18 AM
The pic was 2 megabytes when selected. Nice Keizan pot that Akio gave me a couple of years ago.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 02, 2014, 11:35 AM
Ok,  I'll give it a shot.

Pics of the pot before potting it up, and the tree as received at Plant City.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: John Kirby on March 02, 2014, 01:12 PM
There you go, even us over 30 guys can go this!
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 02, 2014, 01:44 PM
What?  Bonsai?  Or post pictures?

Boon put Facebook on my iphone at the last Intensive.  I'm totally clueless about that!
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: John Kirby on March 02, 2014, 01:58 PM
Post pictures, the v
Bonsai is still under consideration.....
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Gaffer on March 05, 2014, 04:21 PM
Thanks John
I will give it a boot
Qualicum brian
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Judy on March 06, 2014, 08:15 AM
Adair, glad you were able to get the pictures to post.  One question about that pine, does it feel off balance in person?  It feels like it's unstable in the photos.  Looks like a large base!
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 08, 2014, 09:05 AM
Hmm... It doesn't look unbalanced to me in person. I think the photo conveys that feeling because of my fence in the background.

I am going to meet with Boon this week, and I'll get his comments. He may also do some adjusting of the branches. The was recently shipped in from California where Peter had wired it. I could tell that some branches were not in the proper position due to being jostled during shipping. I corrected some of them, and the apex was slightly damaged, too. I knew I would be meeting with Boon, so I thought I'd wait and let him take a look at it.

Peter did a very good job of wiring, it's fun to inspect the details. I'd like to think I could wire it as well as he since we are both Boon trained. But I know Peter is MUCH faster!  I've seen him in action.

I'll report back after Boon has seen it.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 08, 2014, 10:32 AM
Oh, another comment about the styling of this tree...

Judy, perhaps you think the first branch off to the left is unbalancing the composition.  Maybe...

At the last Intensive with Boon, we discussed slant styles.  Here in the USA, we tend to have the first branch go back opposite of the lean of the tree, to "balance the composition".  In Japan, they tend to have the first branch move in the same direction as the slant, the thought being that the tree is moving that direction for a reason, so the primary branch would be, too.

I think it would look good either way.

The first branch on the right actually emerges from the trunk directly towards the front.  But it's been trained to move right almost immediately, so you don't notice that until you look at it from directly above the tree.  Like all the "manufactured" JWP we see here in the USA, it's got it's flaws.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Judy on March 08, 2014, 10:51 AM
Thanks Adair for the additional info, I do understand, as mine also have flaws, just have to do the best to minimize... And pictures are never like seeing the actual tree, so it's difficult to interpret the flow from a photo.
I am interested to see what Boon has to say, please post any pictures after.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Herman on March 27, 2014, 03:17 AM
Hi Adair,

Is there any way to thicken the white pine trunk , ie the section of trunk above the thick black pine understock?

this will do a lot for the tree if it can be done.

will grafting vigorous black pine shoots at key locations and using them as sacrifice branches not work?
this is a long shot idea lol

What would your solution be, if you would have seen it as a problem?

best regards
Herman
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on March 27, 2014, 06:31 AM
Herman, you do have a creative mind!

I'm afraid that if you did do something like that, the black pine lower trunk would get even larger.

The best we can do is position a branch to hide the graft union a bit. This one is getting old enough so that the white pine trunk is beginning to lose the smooth grey texture and develop flakey bark.

It is what it is.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Herman on March 28, 2014, 02:14 AM
yes you are right, and at the rate white pine thickens it will never catch up, interesting.

 ;D i do get ahead of myself sometimes hehehe

I looked at the last photo you posted of it, and it looks like that first right branch will be able to do the trick of hiding the thickness of the understock enough to make the upper white pine trunk look more in proportion

will be impressive when it fills out.

best regards
Herman
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Herman on August 06, 2014, 08:27 AM
Any update on this? what was Boon's comments on this tree?

kind regards
Herman
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on August 06, 2014, 09:04 AM
Actually, I have a problem with this tree!  The apex has died. Physical damage.

When I bought it, I saw the break, and applied cut paste, but it didn't help.

I don't know how it happened, exactly. I don't know if it broke when Peter wired it, or if it broke during shipping from California. There is a lot of wire right at that spot, and some of Peter's cut paste. So I know he did some damage. Was it further damaged in shipment?  I don't know. There was also a minor branch that died. Not a big deal on that.

It has survived my repotting well, other than those issues. Those weren't due to my repot. Although I thought I was pretty radical on the repot, Boon says it needed a "half bare root" repot! I guess I'll do that this year. When I potted it up, I found three layers of old screening where, in the past, whoever repotted it hadn't worked the bottom, they had just lifted the tree out of the old pot, and plunked in the new pot, screen and all! 

So, assuming it had been slip potted every 3 years, I removed about 10 years worth of  pot bound roots!

I'm sad I've lost the apex. I'll just have to figure out how to reposition the other upper branches and let another one grow in. Might have to graft one.

I'll go out and take a picture.   :(

Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Herman on August 06, 2014, 09:15 AM
O WEI!

I feel for you Mr Adair! I know how shiddy it feels when something like this happens to one's trees...is it beyond saving for bonsai? or will you be able to push the tree into a new direction?

I'll wait for the pic, I guess

Kind regards
Herman
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Chrisl on August 06, 2014, 10:18 AM
Actually, I have a problem with this tree!  The apex has died. Physical damage.

When I bought it, I saw the break, and applied cut paste, but it didn't help.

I don't know how it happened, exactly. I don't know if it broke when Peter wired it, or if it broke during shipping from California. There is a lot of wire right at that spot, and some of Peter's cut paste. So I know he did some damage. Was it further damaged in shipment?  I don't know. There was also a minor branch that died. Not a big deal on that.

It has survived my repotting well, other than those issues. Those weren't due to my repot. Although I thought I was pretty radical on the repot, Boon says it needed a "half bare root" repot! I guess I'll do that this year. When I potted it up, I found three layers of old screening where, in the past, whoever repotted it hadn't worked the bottom, they had just lifted the tree out of the old pot, and plunked in the new pot, screen and all! 

So, assuming it had been slip potted every 3 years, I removed about 10 years worth of  pot bound roots!

I'm sad I've lost the apex. I'll just have to figure out how to reposition the other upper branches and let another one grow in. Might have to graft one.

I'll go out and take a picture.   :(



So sorry for ya Adair!!  Though, it might be not terrible in the end if it makes the tree a bit shorter.  Fingers crossed for you!
Chris
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Adair M on August 06, 2014, 10:28 AM
Here's the tree from above.  I'll take a side shot when I have a chance to set up a decent background.
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Sorce on August 07, 2014, 04:50 AM
Adair.

  In all kindness, F that apex. I think it was a bit lanky anyway.

2 growing seasons. You will have a much better tree IMO.

Definitely a blessing in disguise.

Sorce
Title: Re: My "Peter Tea" white pine
Post by: Herman on August 07, 2014, 06:12 AM
Hi Mr Adair,

I've stared at the first photo you've posted of this tree long and hard, I don't think you now have a shorter apex,in other words I don't think if you wired a branch up as a new leader/apex that you will save on height so that the pine could look shorter, grafting on the other hand will do the trick. and as Sorce stated, it will look a lot more powerful with a shorter apex, just to grow the side branches out more to make a wider more masculine silhouette to match that beast of a trunk and hide the graft union

still a damn nice tree :) and it could've been worse, luckily just a part of the apex died...

kind regards
Herman