Author Topic: JWP....Help!  (Read 5305 times)

Bonsaiguru

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JWP....Help!
« on: June 04, 2011, 06:22 PM »
This is a white pine that was recently repotted. It was imported in 2008. I noticed the new growth from the top was going dead. I am sure I lost the top, but I can see that the middle and bottom is pushing new growth (a relief!). My question is what cause the top growth to died? I was thinking maybe root rot, or some type of fungus? When I noticed the die back, I remove the cakes and have not fertilizer. I just recently water it with seaweed and B! Vitamin solution.

I figure if I lost the top I have a new apex right below the overhanging branch from the top. I can also make the dead branches into Jin and shari
 

T-Town Bonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2011, 09:38 PM »
My guess would be your zone, I lived in 7 and it was too hot and dry for white pines.  Don't think mine even lasted a year in OKC. 
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2011, 11:17 PM »
I am in 9a zone (SF Eastbay) It does it hot, but not that hot. I have kept JWP with no problems out here, but I also have lost some few. I think it is fungus.
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2011, 04:36 PM »
My first thought would be fungus too, but it's difficult to tell from the photo.  What leads you to believe it's fungus?  Any signs, etc?  What are your growing conditions, soil, watering habits?
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2011, 05:26 PM »
I know JWP like to be on the dryer side, so I usually allow it to dry out a bit before watering. Though it has been grafter on JBP, I still think it prefers to dry out a bit before watering.

One of my problems watering, is knowing when. For example, I have check the soil with chopsticks and sometimes my finger, at times it is hard to tell if it needs watering. Lately, I go but the weight of it. As most of my Pines are in Plastic training pot I can see the difference in weight when it drys out. For instance, when picking up the pot, as it drys out, the bottom stays heavy and the top lighter, when it needs watering the bottom tends to balance out with the top. Again, I don't if the method would work for the long run.

When checking the soil I try to get to an inch and see if it needs watering, but even with this method it can be tricky (for me). I guess that is why they call it the "Art of Watering"....

I thought it was fungus because when I  remove the died needles they were dried out even the new growth from the top were dry out not burned.

I was told on another forum to use Capton fungicide once or twice a year as a precaution. Don't if anyone here has used it in the matter.
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2011, 06:31 PM »
What kind of soil?  How do you water?
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2011, 07:32 PM »
It is done in Japanese mixture from large particles at the bottom to smaller ones at the top. The bottom has large hyuga rock and the middle is medium akadama,  and at the top is small akadama, red and black lava rock.

I usually water it with a water can or a water hose (shower).

I think the Japanese mixture is great, but great in Japan. I prefer to have a uniform mixture with the only exception of having large hyuga rocks at the bottom.

By the way, Thanks MastuBonsai for helping me. I had read some of your post and no doubt you have a lot knowledge of bonsai.
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2011, 09:29 AM »
Pure akadama in the middle layer might be holding quite a bit of water, unless the granular size is quite large.  Are all the soil components sifted?  When you water, are you watering the foliage also?  That might contribute to some fungus growth. 

Are there any other affected bonsai on your bench?  Any yard trees in the area?

I also wonder if there might be some embedded wire still in/on the trunk that finally constricted the top?
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2011, 10:24 AM »
The soil was sifted, but you may right about holding a bit more water in the middle due to the med. Akadama.

I do water the foliage, by misting it when I water.

I don't have any other trees infected.

Interesting about the wire theory, I think you may be right about it. There is wire holding down the tree and it is coming across the the trunk, but the tree was repotted this spring so I don't if it makes a difference
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2011, 10:30 AM »
How was it repotted?  Who repotted?  When exactly was it repotted?  Have you seen Boon's repotting DVD?  Wired into the pot is common practice, and not what I was referring to.  It looks like there are very deep grooves in the trunk high up.  Any wire still in there?

I would recommend against watering/misting the foliage of trees that you suspect are susceptible to fungal infections.

 

John Kirby

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2011, 12:15 PM »
John, usually the embedded wires leave a route for Phloem and Xylem to communicate up and down the trunk. The akadama layer in the middle is concerning. I would suggest looking up Bay Island Bonsai and seeing about joining and learning the fundamentals in a very positive environment. John
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2011, 01:22 PM »
Agreed.  Squinting at the picture it looked like a lot of very tightly spiralled scars at the top that concerned me, with what looks like wire sticking out at the top.
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2011, 03:01 PM »
Actually no wire on the top, and I have not misted since I noticed the dry up needles.

Agreed, I will be joining Bay Island Bonsai, just need to work out my work schedule.

What do you think about using Captan fungicide?
 

Bonsaiguru

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2011, 11:30 PM »
It was root rot....damn it! Today, I decided to look under the soil and noticed that there were chucks of akadama clogging some of the roots. I spray some multi-fungicide (on roots), remove the bad roots and planted in pumice and lava rock only. Water the soil with B1 and seaweed extract. We will see if I am able to save it.

I only remove all the chucks of akadama and loosen the roots and spread them out.

time will only tell....

 

tanlu

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Re: JWP....Help!
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2011, 01:23 PM »
You did the right thing by checking the roots. Judging by the photo the rest of the tree seems to be healthy, but one can never be too sure unless you're there. I think turning the dead apex into a jin will add more interest and character to the tree.

I personally think that akadama is too soft and breaks down too fast. Look for a medium like turface that holds water well, but has less dust and doesn't break down so quickly.