Author Topic: The "Cloud" and its cuttings  (Read 5415 times)

Don Blackmond

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The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« on: September 25, 2009, 08:24 AM »
Joe Samuels pioneered ficus nerifolia as we know them here in the USA.  He died in 2007 but his trees live on.  The Art of Bonsai Project did a feature on him and his famous nerifolia, "Cloud."  You can read the feature here:

http://www.artofbonsai.org/galleries/samuels.php 

Its a good read and a great progresion of this famous tree.  The 2 photos here show Cloud with and without leaves during the 1980's.  Its a super tree.

Many cuttings have been taken from Cloud.  I wonder how many are still alive and where they are.
 

Don Blackmond

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2009, 08:29 AM »
This tree is a direct decendent of Cloud, taken as a cutting many years ago.  Known as "Son of Cloud."
 

Don Blackmond

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2009, 08:42 AM »
This tree is an indirect decendent of Cloud and was taken as a cutting from Son of Cloud many years ago.  The first photo shows it earlier this season right after the pot broke while moving it (its heavy).  The next 2 photos show it leafing out after being defoliated.  The last photo shows the rock and roots.
 

Rick Moquin

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2009, 09:06 AM »
Son of a gun  ;D (not related) Nice descendants, especially the ROR
 

rockm

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2009, 01:10 PM »
Technically, they're not decendents. They are the same tree. Cuttings are clones of the original, same genetic material...
Nice trees, no matter what the lineage... :)
 

Don Blackmond

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2009, 02:14 PM »
Technically, they're not decendents. They are the same tree.

Good point, technically.
 

John Kirby

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2009, 11:50 PM »
Actually Don, you should have said "good point exactly". Now get to work and make them look like themselves, ah, before they were their current selves, got it?
 

King Kong

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2009, 05:23 AM »
Plants produced by asexual reproduction (agamogenesis) or vegetative reproduction. This ficus would fall into this category but they are also reproduced by tissue culture as well now.

__gary
 

Don Blackmond

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2009, 07:36 AM »
Actually Don, you should have said "good point exactly". Now get to work and make them look like themselves, ah, before they were their current selves, got it?

actually, I should have spelled it correctly.  descendant.  there.  all is correct now.
 

bonsaihunk

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2009, 01:46 PM »
Hi Don and Everyone,
I have plants bought from Joe in the late 1970's or early 1980's. My impression is that Joe "discovered" the salicaria, Willow Leaf, in a south Florida nursery. There may be others who also had the material at the same time and have rights to claim discovery. In any case it is quite likely that all the Willow Leaf's are descended from the same one or two plants. Even salicaria that I have seen in other countries have been propagated from the south Florida original stock plant(s).
Since salicaria is unkown in the wild its origin has given rise to great speculation. No one has ever shown pictures of salicaria growing in the wild although many folks claim to have seen it somewhere out there. If you know of a shot and description of it in the wild please forward it on to me.
In any case it's a great material and delighted to see so many good ones shown here.
Jerry "Bonsaihunk".
 

King Kong

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2009, 02:39 PM »
 No news
__gary
« Last Edit: September 26, 2009, 02:54 PM by King Kong »
 

clrosner

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2009, 07:24 PM »
Jim Smith has some beautiful similar trees, which I wonder if they are related to the Cloud. Jim added the number 89 due to a freeze (1989) that killed the trees down to the trunks, and when they recovered had a different shape to the lance-shaped leaves. I am fortunate to own one of these beauties.

Warmest regards to all,

Carl
 

Dustin Mann

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #12 on: October 04, 2009, 09:46 PM »
Hi Carl: There were a number of people that received cuttings of the Cloud directly from Joe Samuels prior to 1984. Mentioned is Jerry Meislik(posted above). In addition, Mary Miller(Bonsai Bench-until Hurricane Andrew wiped out in 1992); Helen Sauder(had one in Washington D.C. collection); Norm Nelson had large banyon from Joe at nursery in Coral Gables late 80's(I saw tree in 95-forget name of place);I am sure Jim Moody,Harold Harvey,Ernie Fernandez,Ed Trout in Florida all have/or had cuttings as well. I am guessing the nursery was Avant Gardens(Delray Beach) as they were always experimenting. They had Ceiling Wax Palm(Cyrtostachys) and Triangle Palm(Neodypsis) in early 70's for sale in small cans ahead of everybody else(I was a palm wacko then). Glen Hilton or Alva Haynes may be able to identify nursery Joe went to.  Dustin Mann ::)
 

clrosner

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #13 on: October 05, 2009, 06:26 AM »
Thank you Dustin!
That information is fascinating and quite helpful, I do appreciate it.
Warmest regards,
Carl
 

bonsaihunk

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Re: The "Cloud" and its cuttings
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2009, 04:46 PM »
Dustin and Carl.
The nursery was Fantastic Gardens and in it was a fabulous collection of bonsai that I visited regularly. I was to learn some time after that these were all Joe Samuels' trees. I first met Joe there and it was a most fortunate thing for me to spend time with him and to learn from him.
I do miss him.
Jerry "Bonsaihunk"