Bonsai Study Group Forum

Species Specific => Japanese Maple Bonsai Discussion => Topic started by: shimsuki on March 16, 2010, 04:20 PM

Title: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on March 16, 2010, 04:20 PM
Has anyone ever heard of or think that coral bark japanese maple, aka acer palmatum sango kaku, would be a good species for bonsai. They have red bark, which make them a popular plant in the winter time. This species is becoming popular in the gardening world, and I was wondering of what you all thought of one as a bonsai.

Shimsuki
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: bwaynef on March 16, 2010, 04:32 PM
I have some Sango Kaku seedlings (i know, but they seem to have a LOT of the same characteristics so far) that I'm going to develop. 

I don't think Sango Kaku is a particularly vigorous grower, as most red-foliaged (or tinged) trees don't seem to be (since the chlorophyll isn't there to convert light to food) but its no slouch either.  I bet in spite of that, there's some potential.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on March 16, 2010, 05:05 PM
I have some Sango Kaku seedlings (i know, but they seem to have a LOT of the same characteristics so far) that I'm going to develop. 

I don't think Sango Kaku is a particularly vigorous grower, as most red-foliaged (or tinged) trees don't seem to be (since the chlorophyll isn't there to convert light to food) but its no slouch either.  I bet in spite of that, there's some potential.

The sango kaku variety has lime green leaves.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: steve on March 16, 2010, 07:26 PM
The sango kaku variety has lime green leaves.

I beg to differ with you:

http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/consumer/factsheets/trees-new/acer_palmatum_sangokaku.html (http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/consumer/factsheets/trees-new/acer_palmatum_sangokaku.html)
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: akeppler on March 16, 2010, 08:26 PM
The sango kaku variety has lime green leaves.

I beg to differ with you:

http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/consumer/factsheets/trees-new/acer_palmatum_sangokaku.html (http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/consumer/factsheets/trees-new/acer_palmatum_sangokaku.html)

Before you beg...you should see one for yourself. I have one in my backyard. The leaves are brilliant lime green. This is an awesome tree.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on March 16, 2010, 08:37 PM
I beg to differ with you

"Leaf color is a bright tone of green" (pg. 136 Japanese Maples second edition by J.D. Vertrees) One of the best japanese maple books.

http://www.mobot.org/gardeninghelp/images/low/D356-0903091gk.jpg (http://www.mobot.org/gardeninghelp/images/low/D356-0903091gk.jpg) Missouri Botanical Gardens

http://www.iseli-nursery.com/photopages/AcerpalmatumSangoKaku.htm (http://www.iseli-nursery.com/photopages/AcerpalmatumSangoKaku.htm) Iseli Nursery, well known nursery in Oregon

"Foliage Color: Light Green" http://www.monrovia.com/plant-catalog/plants/37/coral-bark-japanese-maple.php (http://www.monrovia.com/plant-catalog/plants/37/coral-bark-japanese-maple.php) Monrovia Nursery



Shimsuki
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on March 16, 2010, 08:40 PM
Before you beg...you should see one for yourself. I have one in my backyard. The leaves are brilliant lime green. This is an awesome tree.

We replied at the same time.


Al,
Do you think it would make a good bonsai, or would the red bark be unappealing?


Shim
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: John Kirby on March 16, 2010, 11:53 PM
long internodes, tough in containers. Great tree for a young guy to struggle with.

John

(Bill Valvanis probably has a great one in a bonsai pot......)
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: akeppler on March 17, 2010, 01:25 AM
I have seen small ones, never any with any caliper in the trunk.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on March 17, 2010, 10:56 AM
I am thinking of doing a trunk chop on one.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: akeppler on March 17, 2010, 01:45 PM
My tree in my backyard is fairly fast grower. Has leaves like shishigashira in clumps and branches grow quite fast. Don't know how trunks fatten up though, too soon to tell since this is the third spring since I planted it. I did take some seed last year, a handfull at best, but will plant those out this week. see what I get.

Will keep you imformed of their progress.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: ken duncan on March 17, 2010, 06:24 PM
Here is a picture of one that I bought as a Bonsai started from nursery stock about 15 years ago, it was grafted about 4 or 5 inches from the root spread. They do not seem to root well so I think that most are grown by grafting.
Ken
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: donmaple on March 17, 2010, 07:22 PM
Bought one a few weeks ago at Home Depot. Trimmed the roots and potted it right up. We'll see how it does in a Bonsai pot, if not well then into the ground it goes. Thanks Ken, yours looks pretty good and healthy. Does the branches on yours get coral, says it needs cold to get good color. Don.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: M.B. on March 18, 2010, 01:51 AM
I have a very large one still in a fifteen gallon nursery pot. I have tried to airlayer off some of the tree for 3 years. For various reasons I have been unsucessful but will try again on another section this year. After this last attempt I'll finally start working on my original plan, to bonsai the bottom part of this tree. The trunk is over 3 inches but I haven't dug down to see what kind of nebari I may be dealing with. I have found it to be pretty much typical Japanese maple stock, average water, average fertalizer, ect.
Mary B.
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: ken duncan on March 18, 2010, 06:31 AM
Hi Don, thank You. The new twigs stay red but seem to fade in color as they age, also this tree has been in the shade all winter and the Sun helps with the color.
Ken
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: ken duncan on March 23, 2010, 04:25 PM
Here is a pic that shows more color.
Ken
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: riprap on April 05, 2010, 09:38 PM
One thing about Sangokaku is that they tend to have upward-trending branches.  So to achieve the traditional Japanese Mountain Maple harmony of a spreading canopy requires wiring and/or trimming back to horizontally pointing buds.  However, there is a picture of a very fine vase-shaped specimen (actually broom style, I suppose) in the Bay Island Bonsai book "An Exhibition of Fine Bonsai 2000-2004."

It is sometimes felt that plant varieties that have an idiosyncratic character are not ideal for bonsai.  Hence, you seldom see variegated-leaf cultivars trained as bonsai.  I think Sangokaku is sort of on the edge in this respect.  And that said, I bought and chopped a nursery can plant with 1" base caliper this spring (having failed in an air-layer attempt last year) and look forward to training it in the informal upright style.

Barry
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: shimsuki on December 12, 2010, 04:33 PM
I happened to run across this post today, and it reminded me of this thread. I would like to try something like this, I have a few maples on the bench in mind  ;D

http://bonsaitonight.com/2010/04/13/repotting-a-japanese-maple/ (http://bonsaitonight.com/2010/04/13/repotting-a-japanese-maple/)

Andrew
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: JRob on December 12, 2010, 07:06 PM
Shim et all,

If you want to see pictures of some fantastic nebari check out Sam & KJ's blog at www.samedge.wordpress.com (http://www.samedge.wordpress.com) the first December 2010 post.

JRob
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: donmaple on January 03, 2011, 04:02 PM
Well it's obviously been cold enough here for this maple to get it's color. Here is my Coral Bark JM in all it's glory. I dropped it into a bonsai pot right away after getting it last spring. It seems to like the new home. Don
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: boon on March 18, 2011, 03:49 AM
here is one of sango kaku started from nursery stock about 15 years ago.  it belongs to one of BIB members. 
reddish color bark will turn grey when it gets old.  older specimen will have grey bark and bright red tips in winter
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: MatsuBonsai on March 18, 2011, 04:50 PM
Excellent tree, and great looking display.  Thanks for sharing Boon!
Title: Re: acer palmatum sango kaku
Post by: Chrisl on February 14, 2012, 10:23 AM
long internodes, tough in containers. Great tree for a young guy to struggle with.

John

(Bill Valvanis probably has a great one in a bonsai pot......)

Glad I ran across this old thread.  I was going to air layer a big one we have in the backyard.  But after reading what John said, and MB's 3x failure from air layer has convinced me to just leave it alone and be a beautiful ornamental tree.  Btw, mine too has bright green leaves.