Bonsai Study Group Forum

Species Specific => Japanese Black Pine Bonsai Discussion => Topic started by: pwk5017 on June 04, 2011, 12:55 AM

Title: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: pwk5017 on June 04, 2011, 12:55 AM
Ok, I know this topic has been covered before, and there is even a popular thread dedicated to it, but when exactly do you cut the roots?  I have read and reread, "when the stems turn violet"  I have grown JBP seed for 3 years and I am not sure the stems have ever turned purple.  They turned a ruddy red/pink, but I am not certain it could ever be considered purple/violet.  I am asking about this now, because I have never done a large scale cutting before and I want to time it correctly so I dont lose 300-500 seedlings.  I will post a picture in the am so someone can tell me if it is time or not. Also, does the IBA concentration of the rooting hormone matter?  I am going to try a rooting gel of .55% IBA.

Patrick
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: pwk5017 on June 04, 2011, 01:13 PM
Ok, here are the macro shots
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: pwk5017 on June 04, 2011, 03:00 PM
Ok, I have received several replies at another bonsai forum, so just for the record NOW is the proper time to sever the roots.  I give permission to whoever started the "growing mikawa black pine from seed" to use my photos to illustrate the color of the stems. 
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: Treebeard55 on June 04, 2011, 04:07 PM
Information I've seen, in Bonsai Today 106, said to cut them when they turned "reddish." That would confirm what you say, that now is the time.
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: gtuthill on June 04, 2011, 11:40 PM
Thanks for the clarification, I've not done this technique before and it does seem a bit of a leap of faith  :D
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: bwaynef on June 05, 2011, 08:36 PM
You only need faith that first time.  Many of us here, myself included will attest to the fact that the seedlings will resprout roots just like the pictures in those articles suggest they will.
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: Treebeard55 on June 06, 2011, 10:02 PM
Does anyone here know if the same technique will work on other pines -- ponderosa, Japanese red, Scots, Austrian?

The article I mentioned above seemed to imply it was worth trying, at least, on other pines besides JBP. Anyone have any such experience?
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: pwk5017 on June 16, 2011, 01:23 AM
I have seen it documented on someone's blog where they used scots pine instead and the technique worked.  Cant confirm the others, but why would you be growing ponderosa from seed?
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: Treebeard55 on June 16, 2011, 01:46 PM
... why would you be growing ponderosa from seed?

Good question!  :D Main reasons: to learn more about the species, and just for abstract knowledge.

Also, I'm looking at a lack of good pre-bonsai stock here in northern IN. The closest suppliers are in Indianapolis and Chicago, both 3-4 hours drive away. Not only am I considering ways to keep myself supplied, but also to have material available for others. That's why I'm thinking about trying the technique with a number of different pine species.

One can learn what to look for in general-nursery stock. In fact, I presented a program on that topic to our club a couple of years ago. (Then we piled into cars and headed for a nearby nursery to use what we'd learned.) But it is easier when one can buy stock that has been grown with bonsai in mind.
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: beboosg on June 20, 2011, 03:31 AM
Information I've seen, in Bonsai Today 106, said to cut them when they turned "reddish." That would confirm what you say, that now is the time.
Tks for your advises. But how long do they turn "reddish"? I'm from Ho Chi Minh city - Viet Nam. Nice to meet you
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: cray13 on June 22, 2011, 04:11 PM
Does anyone here know if the same technique will work on other pines -- ponderosa, Japanese red, Scots, Austrian?

The article I mentioned above seemed to imply it was worth trying, at least, on other pines besides JBP. Anyone have any such experience?

I'm trying Mugo Pine this year... have finished the initial root pruning about two weeks ago and all seems well so far.

Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: cray13 on June 22, 2011, 04:18 PM
Ok, I have received several replies at another bonsai forum, so just for the record NOW is the proper time to sever the roots.  I give permission to whoever started the "growing mikawa black pine from seed" to use my photos to illustrate the color of the stems. 


I authored the "growing mikawa black pine from seed" thread and will gladly link your macro images to that thread.  You are correct, NOW is the right time to do the first root pruning.  Perhaps violet isn't the best description of the color, but your images definitely represent the color change you're looking for...

You'll need to protect them from wind, direct sunlight and heavy downpours that may wash the little guy out.  They will be very fragile for the first several weeks after the root pruning.  Good luck.
Title: Re: When to cut roots off JBP
Post by: John Kirby on July 01, 2011, 11:08 AM
Jonas did a nice piece http://bonsaitonight.com/2011/07/01/how-to-create-seedling-cuttings-japanese-black-pine/ (http://bonsaitonight.com/2011/07/01/how-to-create-seedling-cuttings-japanese-black-pine/)