Author Topic: 4 foot tall JBP...?  (Read 3731 times)

Kajukid

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4 foot tall JBP...?
« on: September 20, 2011, 05:46 PM »
okay so i was a home depot today and they have 2 JBP that are 4 feet tall for $19...i had them put one on hold for me because i want to ask a question to all you pine pros...in the last pic i put a red line where i would like to cut it down to, my questions are...

1. will it be okay to cut at that spot?
2. will it back bud?
3. what time of the season should i cut it back??
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2011, 10:29 PM »
Kajukid,

It's a little hard to tell from the pictures. You're in one of the most active bonsai communities in the US. Check out club auctions and sales and honest bonsai nurseries and growers.  There's a ton of them in your area.
 

Kajukid

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2011, 11:16 PM »
can JBP be air layered??
 

nathanbs

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2011, 12:04 AM »
young black pines back bud very well. If you are determined to make this one of your projects then my advice is do not touch roots at this point and cut as low as you can but above maybe the 2 or 3 lowest branches in mid to late winter and it will bud out like crazy. Dont repot until the following winter.
 

Kajukid

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2011, 12:10 AM »
young black pines back bud very well. If you are determined to make this one of your projects then my advice is do not touch roots at this point and cut as low as you can but above maybe the 2 or 3 lowest branches in mid to late winter and it will bud out like crazy. Dont repot until the following winter.
well damn,,...i just repotted it...ugh i knew i shouldnt have...okay so what do u think i should do now...just let it grow until next year, and then do what you just said????
 

bonsaiTom

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2011, 06:31 AM »
okay so i was a home depot today and they have 2 JBP that are 4 feet tall for $19...i had them put one on hold for me because i want to ask a question to all you pine pros...in the last pic i put a red line where i would like to cut it down to, my questions are...

1. will it be okay to cut at that spot?
2. will it back bud?
3. what time of the season should i cut it back??
In your first line you say that this tree is being held for you until you ask the pine pros. Then with questions asked and a reply comes back (same day) you say "well damn.....I just repotted it"

Jumped the gun? I thought Home Depot was still holding it.

All newly acquired trees should be left alone for awhile when you first get them home. Slow down, take some time to just 'stare at them', study them. Turn them around, tilt, lean, twist - you know what I'm saying. Then start with the questions and wait several more days for the answers and opinions. While waiting you will be busy #1 caring for it #2 reading other threads about this tree type, books and articles #3 coming up with an 'image' in your mind for where it should go in the near and more distant future.

New threads that start with "So I got this tree today - and I repotted it - or I trunk chopped it - or I styled it (whatever) show that very little thought went into any of this. Consider the tree. Take the time to appreciate it and plan for 'down the road' and what will ultimately bring out the best features and, more than that, the best health and vigor.

One reply to your question (MatsuBonsai) concerned the great bonsai clubs and nurseries in your area. Club auctions and auctions are great sources. $19 might get you something really cool - and off to a good start. Local nurseries would really appreciate your business - ( and need your $)  HOME DEPOT does not!
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 06:42 AM by bonsaiTom »
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2011, 08:55 AM »
okay so what do u think i should do now...

My suggestion is find a jar.  Every time you feel the urge to spend money on something bonsai related then put that amount in the jar, and walk away.  My guess, with the amount of eagerness and enthusiasm you've shown recently is that within 1 month you'll have enough money to join one of the many local clubs, and perhaps enough to buy some decent starter material with a good future.  The club members should provide you with enough guidance to help you with a better start than what you would be able to manage on your own. 

Keep up the enthusiasm and utilize the wealth of resources at your disposal (clubs, teachers, dedicated bonsai nurseries).

Here's a small list to get you going:
Bonsai Boon
Bay Island Bonsai
Bonsai Society of San Francisco
Golden State Bonsai Federation
Jim Gremel
Muranaka Bonsai Nursery
Grove Way Bonsai Nursery - Hayward, CA
etc., etc.
 

Owen Reich

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2011, 10:04 AM »
I agree with John on this for sure.  Your enthusiasm for bonsai is commendable.  The fact that you are seeking advise from others is great.  A local club will serve you well and keep you from making mistakes that you will regret on your trees in the coming years.  Many new hobbyists (including myself years ago) amass a small army of species of trees that are commonly used for bonsai but likely have no potential to be truly excellent trees in the future.  Even now, I look around at the bonsai here in Japan and have mentally checked which trees I will liquidate when I return to the states in December.  This is from the collection I culled aggressively last year.  I'll probably keep 10 of the 50 remaining bonsai.  Maybe less.  Julian Adams has a rule for his bonsai (I'm paraphrasing) to only buy a tree if willing to get rid of 2 (or 3?) in his current collection.  I cannot agree more with John on this.  Starting bonsai from seed or cuttings is without a doubt rewarding, but you sound like you are ready to slice and dice some trees so local bonsai nurseries and auctions are your best bet.   
 

nathanbs

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2011, 10:16 AM »
yes definitely slow down. Take it from me, I can relate.  I had accumulated almost 150 trees in pots/containers and almost 300 trees in the ground in just over 1 year of getting into bonsai.  However during that period i sought out instruction from 3 different bonsai masters(which im still currently take classes with), joined 5 bonsai clubs, and have read approximately 30 bonsai books and probably 120 bonsai magazines. I currently would like to sell atleast 1/3 of my potted trees so that i can enjoy the remaing 2/3 that much more both visually(be nice to spread them out a bit) but also being able to spend more time with each one refining them. At some point i should probably only have 20-30 refined trees otherwise it will be a full time job keeping them in order.
As far as this current BP project, hopefully it survives being that it was repotted at the wrong time of year. Yes leave it alone until next winter about 16 months from now before you chop it.
 

Kajukid

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2011, 10:42 AM »
okay so what do u think i should do now...

My suggestion is find a jar.  Every time you feel the urge to spend money on something bonsai related then put that amount in the jar, and walk away.  My guess, with the amount of eagerness and enthusiasm you've shown recently is that within 1 month you'll have enough money to join one of the many local clubs, and perhaps enough to buy some decent starter material with a good future.  The club members should provide you with enough guidance to help you with a better start than what you would be able to manage on your own. 

Keep up the enthusiasm and utilize the wealth of resources at your disposal (clubs, teachers, dedicated bonsai nurseries).

Here's a small list to get you going:
Bonsai Boon
Bay Island Bonsai
Bonsai Society of San Francisco
Golden State Bonsai Federation
Jim Gremel
Muranaka Bonsai Nursery
Grove Way Bonsai Nursery - Hayward, CA
etc., etc.
oh man Mastu, you could of said it better...i do need to slow my role...and i like the jar thing.....

and yes i did buy the tree, for $20 i felt like i could pass on it.....

but thank you every one...you just made me slap myself in the face to wake up and realize i do need to slow down...
 

Kajukid

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2011, 10:46 AM »
oh and yes i know the tree will survie because i repotted a Scots pine a couple of weeks ago and the candles are start to open and get bigger....
 

bonsaiTom

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2011, 12:41 PM »
Maybe luck - but more likely a residual effect - the 'juices still flowing' - the real long-term health remains to be seen, like in another season or two.

But listen, all these experienced helpers know that you are rushing things. We've been there - done that. It is so hard to direct all this enthusiasm into constructive action and patience. Listen & learn.

But don't get pissed. Get smart.
Hang in there.  8)
 

jtucker

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2011, 01:00 PM »
1) Scots pine and JBP are different species, not different varieties of the same species. Just because one works, doesn't mean the other will. There could also be a zillion differences in the trees' health before you did what you did.

2) We pick a lot of tree species to work on because they're tough. They can withstand work that we do with them. Olives, Elms, Pines, Junipers, they all are some tough sons of guns in the plant world. It's quite possible that your trees will SURVIVE doing out-of-season operations, but they MUST be given time to recover. For the current tree in question, this means just water it and fertilize it. I would do this as long as you can stand it, to be sure it's really growing well, and then do a LITTLE bit of work in the spring. The reason that there are recommended times to do things is that thousands of people have worked hundreds of years finding the OPTIMUM times for everything to be done.

3) I agree with Nathan. I'm in a similar process of wading through a yard full of crap that I accumulated over a couple years. Yes it's important to practice on stuff that wouldn't devastate you if you lost. However, there will be a point where you see a bunch of little funky trees in your yard and you need to make a decision to start making bonsai, not just cutting and potting a bunch of little trees.

OR you can cut the living snot out of the tree however you like, kill it, and hopefully learn something that way :-) We've all done it haha
 

Buffrider

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2011, 05:06 PM »
when i first started bonsai i was always going to nurserys and buying $10+ plants to bonsai. Most if not all were crap. Get on sites with lots of pictures and start to study everything you see in the pics from pots to stands to trunks to everything. Then stop spending money on cheap stuff. You will find that the idea of saving that money in a jar will buy you some good material someday. Also this winter put an add in craigslist and say you will come dig unwanted shrups and trees for free if you can keep them. Most of my stuff i have now is stuff that i have gotten from this. Most of these have huge trunks and awesome taper. A few awesome bonsai will always be better then a few hundred crappy trees. hope this helps. Good luck
 

jacksmom

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Re: 4 foot tall JBP...?
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2011, 12:08 PM »
Several members of our club have had some luck approaching home owners and asking if they can remove their old, overgrown hedges for free.  What they have found are some very interesting junipers.  In Minnesota, I believe spring is the best time to try this.  So I may have all winter to scout out some older neighborhoods for material and summon the courage to ask.  But I may consider the Craig's list option also.