Author Topic: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.  (Read 6792 times)

akeppler

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Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« on: June 05, 2012, 08:07 PM »
In his blog:

http://peterteabonsai.wordpress.com/2012/06/05/rebuilding-a-japanese-maple/

Peter talks about using nails with rubber heads on them. I have taken this concept even further several years ago while approach grafting as many as five or six branches on as many as four or five trees at a time. I simply use stationary push pins. They come in two sizes and the shoulder that does the holding is much larger than the small rubber block and the pin has a convenient handle in which to "push" the pin in rather than hammer it in. While I work on a lot of shohin tridents I can't be bothered with trying to hold the graft, the nail, and then try to hit it with a hammer.

Forget that.....

This works easy peasy.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2012, 08:19 PM by akeppler »
 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2012, 08:24 PM »
Here are some shots of the three grafts after removing the scion. the first picture is me being careless and not checking soon enough and the damn tree grew a graft so fast that it actually scarred around the pin and left a perfect round hole. It may take three more years to get rid if that. the other two were better.

Last picture is the tree and how it is coming along.
 

John Kirby

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2012, 09:55 PM »
Al, saw map pins (round version of yours) being used in Kinbon at least a decade ago. Guess Peter is just trying to share with folks how things work, not trying to claim invention.

On Junipers and Pines the nails work much better than pins when trying to hold the approach precisely where you need them, and nail through the branch. Further, Peter misspoke in his text, they are not rubber heads but hard plastic. Boon has been using them for years, shohin and up.

 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2012, 10:13 PM »
Opps sorry, Tough place to post here. I guess if Boon uses them they must be best, Cheers.
 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2012, 11:50 PM »
Being cantankerous and getting to the age of having earned it, I felt it may be better to post what my response had to do with.

There are many of us, not necessarily bonsai professionals that do from time to time have something to offer the bonsai world. I have never seen anyone ever post a thread on any forum in the USA or any magazine in the last ten years written in the english language write anything about approach grafting using a simple push pin. It seems like an easy alternative to useing tape or rubber bands or even nails with whatever kind of head..

I posted this here since many follow Peters blog here and slavishly eat it up like there is no other way to skin a cat.

This is what he posted:

Some of you might be wondering, “where can I find those nails with the rubber on them?”  Me and several people have tried finding these nail in the US with no luck.  They seem to only be available in Japan.  They are mainly used to nail boards onto a frame and come in various lengths and thickness.  For the time being, it looks like if we’re going to use these nails for approach grafting, we either have to make them ourselves import it from Japan.  If you the reader knows of a local place to get it, please share it with everybody in the comment section below.  You would be doing me and everybody else a favor!

I know Peter pretty well and hope maybe he may read this and say thank you!

But....maybe not. There may be others that will read this and say, Al thats a crazy good idea!

Nail thru the graft? Stuck in 1966?
 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2012, 01:58 AM »
Taking this whole mess one step further....cause I'm great that way...(for you Kirby)

why not just go to the hardware store and buy a couple different lengths of carpet tacks and then go by the craft store and buy a couple tubes of plastic beads. You can literally get any size and hole diameter. Buy a whole tube for like $1.19. You could lterally graft two or three hundred trees with a tube of them.

Voila, nail with plastic thing a ma jig. Why does everyone make this so difficult.

Before I used the pushpins, I used to hammer the carpet nails thru a hard rubber washer found in the plumbing dept. at Home Depot. These you can get are about 1/2 inch in diameter and are fairly hard rubber disks about 1/8 thick. The rubber cushions the graft as it grows and provides constant pressure. I just don't like hammering on my trees.

I'm not a bonsai professional though so readers may wish to wait until it is written about on professional bonsai forums or comes out in a magazine or when a professional comes to yout town and charges you like $40.00 for the workshop to show you a nail and plastic bead.
 

jow

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2012, 02:27 AM »
Hmmm interesting topic.

You can pretty much use anything that holds the branch in place. I use large round map pins.

Pics are in this post: http://nichigobonsai.com/2011/11/07/trident-maple-approach-graft/

I find they dont cut in like the push pins you use. I started usingthe push pins like you are but found that more times than not they left scars. Anything will work as long as it holds.
 

Owen Reich

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2012, 04:12 AM »
I use only red push-pins made out of endangered hardwoods.  That will be $200.  :D
 

bwaynef

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2012, 07:49 AM »
Quote from: Al
I posted this here since many follow Peters blog here and slavishly eat it up like there is no other way to skin a cat.

At the risk of throwing this useful thread into an off-topic whirlwind, what's your justification for this?  Specifics welcome, and preferred.
 

John Kirby

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2012, 07:54 AM »
Al, I thought a long time about just not responding, anticipating a long belabored response. I think Peter was just anticipating the questions he seems to get from folks when he makes his technique posts. I get the wire nails from Boon, or as with ths year, from a hardware store in Nagoya. I think your point that there are lots of different ways to do it is apparent, and useful, maybe getting folks to use what they can find.

The professionals all have their quirks and rituals, it is part of the process. The techniques that Boon teaches for grafting have evolved over the years. I think a key event was when he went to Mr. Kawabe's garden a number of years ago and spent some time with him while he was grafting junipers. So saying that folks are stuck in 1966 is one of those gratuitous remarks that I have come to expect, and frequently to tongue in cheek appreciate, on the forums. Smile Al, I am glad that you were able to pry yourself away from the Nuts to come on over, as you know I will always rise to take the bait when you give me the opportunity.
 

John Kirby

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2012, 08:44 AM »
Al, actually to answer your question, there wasa Rey nice piece about grafting with Mr. Urushibata (Taisho-En) in English in Bonsai Focus a couple of years ack- tho he did use 'map' pins with the ball type head. I posted grafting pictures on a Japanese apple shohin using the green headed nail masters being is cussed here.

John
 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2012, 09:24 AM »
I use only red push-pins made out of endangered hardwoods.  That will be $200.  :D

See...Ginkgo Biloba gets it
 

akeppler

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2012, 09:32 AM »
Quote from: Al
I posted this here since many follow Peters blog here and slavishly eat it up like there is no other way to skin a cat.

At the risk of throwing this useful thread into an off-topic whirlwind, what's your justification for this?  Specifics welcome, and preferred.

ThesaurusLegend:  Synonyms Related Words Antonyms
Adj. 1. slavish - blindly imitative; "a slavish copy of the original"
unoriginal - not original; not being or productive of something fresh and unusual; "the manuscript contained unoriginal emendations"; "his life had been unoriginal, conforming completely to the given pattern"- Gwethalyn Graham
 2. slavish - abjectly submissive; characteristic of a slave or servant; "slavish devotion to her job ruled her life"; "a slavish yes-man to the party bosses"- S.H.Adams; "she has become submissive and subservient"
submissive, subservient
servile - submissive or fawning in attitude or behavior; "spoke in a servile tone"; "the incurably servile housekeeper"; "servile tasks such as floor scrubbing and barn work"


Tom Peters said it best...."Perception is all there is".....
 

bonsaitodd

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2012, 10:21 AM »
I don't think Peter is saying that his way is the best way or the only way.  I can see why some people may think that when they feel that they have a much better or more efficient way of doing it.   I Am sure there are many ways to do grafting and we tend to use what is available around us that is most convenient to do the job.  I think a lot of us read the bonsai blogs to gain knowledge and directions on how some of the techniques are executed.  Why don't we just read the blog get the technique of grafting and alter it to his it can work for the individual.  push pin or not, I think it is the idea of securing the scion in place is what I gather to be the importance of the blog.  It is in our nature to question all thinks we do or what others do and what was taught to us.  Its great when someone shares there techniques with us, for us to improve on, if we can.  I think Peter blog is great for the average beginner to ge an insight on how some of the bonsai techniques are done and the don't have to pay the $40. :)
 

John Kirby

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Re: Peter Tea's rebuilding a maple.
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2012, 12:53 PM »
Wow, I guess  the issues here are deeper than I thought. I would suggest that if you have issues with Peter's presentation that you communicate with him directly. I consider Peter to be a good friend, one who is doing something that many find interesting, I personally follow his blog less for the techniques he describes than for the personal things and to see his growth as a bonsai artist.

Back to getting ready for Rochester.

Al, when being specious and covetous, as you appear to be, one should eschew grammatical obfuscation. ;)

« Last Edit: June 06, 2012, 12:58 PM by John Kirby »