Bonsai Study Group Forum

General Category => General Bonsai Discussion => Topic started by: Owen Reich on May 03, 2014, 10:29 PM

Title: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 03, 2014, 10:29 PM
I challenge every lurker on here to post a photo of a project or some other topic on here.  You know who you are.  I'll post something or perhaps others will match the posts.

I'll even start one now.

This is a Larix kaempferi I styled at Meehan's Miniatures in March.  The old front and planting angle were ok, and the stock was developed on site for almost 20 years if I recall correctly.  I flipped the tree to the new angle and will drop it even lower next year when it's repotted and the buds catch up to the new orientation. 

What do you think?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on May 04, 2014, 12:29 AM
  You're right Owen. Us lurkers know who we are. So here is a project of mine.
  Tamarack collected 2 weeks ago.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on May 04, 2014, 12:37 AM
  In fact I feel so bad about just lurking here's another.
  Cork bark elm. Chopped this winter. Already sprouting leaves.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on May 04, 2014, 05:43 AM
Nice challenge. ;D

  Owen. On a elm like MFrary's. How long should one leave that cluster of shoots?
I usually select one branch right away, then rub off the other buds.

I always assumed it would be better to "direct energy" early.

Thanks! Nice larix.

Mfrary. Love the elm!






Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 04, 2014, 06:54 AM
everybody could post new threads........
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on May 04, 2014, 07:13 AM
  Hey Source. I let those shoots grow up a little then pick the ones to keep. These elms put out so many buds at the cut that it's nothing but a mass of green coming out of the cambium layer.
  Once a few strong ones show themselves I pick 1 to build a traditional informal upright or 3 to 5 for a broom.
 This one gets a single leader. I also select the branch placement now.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on May 04, 2014, 10:26 AM
Here are some photos of a 'little jaime' that isn't so little anymore.
I am leaning towards a Literati style.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: fredtruck on May 04, 2014, 12:11 PM
This is my cork bark elm. I bought this from Brent in December. Picture taken about a month ago.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: coh on May 04, 2014, 01:20 PM
Fred, I've always wondered what people did with those massive cork bark elms from Brent - please keep us posted!

I have a yard full of "projects" and could probably fill up an entire forum. I'll just post these photos because I took them a couple of days ago. It's a winter hazel reclamation project...bought from a club member about 2 years ago, she was having trouble with it (most of the top died back). So the first step has been to get it growing vigorously again. I think it's healthy enough now that I can start evaluation what needs to go and focus on the future clump style structure.

I love the flowers and would also be happy to just plant this in the yard if I can't coerce it into a decent bonsai.

Chris

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on May 04, 2014, 02:20 PM
I'll throw a couple in...
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 04, 2014, 06:56 PM
wlambeth, that's the largest Little Jamie I've seen in a container.  Underused native Chameacyparis.  With the small foliage and thin trunk, I think it could work out well.

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on May 05, 2014, 10:19 AM
It was growing in the ground for almost 2 years.
And has been in that pot for about 3.

In a few weeks I'm going to buy some thick gauge copper wire to begin the bending process.
Of course I will use vet wrap under the wire.

Maybe next year I can start reducing the pot size.

Thanks for the reply Owen.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 05, 2014, 08:35 PM
coh, I think that could be a nice clump style.  Branches need to be wired when young or they won't bend well.  I'll be in Rochester tomorrow.  Most of the time will be spent working on trees.  PM me about the vine project. 
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 06, 2014, 08:44 AM
That's a good start  ;D.  I personally know at least 5 more lurkers on here.......

Here's a photo of one of one of the oldest bonsai in America; that is to say, it arrived here at the turn of the last century.  Chamaecyparis obtusa 'Chabo-Hiba'.  At the Larz Anderson Collection owned by Harvard.  In original container and awe-inspiring.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Judy on May 06, 2014, 06:44 PM
Owen, can you post that picture again in a larger format?  It doesn't get very large when you click on it....
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on May 06, 2014, 07:03 PM
   Same tree. Different picture.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 06, 2014, 08:48 PM
Here you go
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Judy on May 07, 2014, 08:00 AM
Yowza.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on May 09, 2014, 08:33 AM
   Google Lars Anderson collection. There's more and the whole story about these glorious trees.
  Since we are on the subject of Hinoki Cypress. Does anyone know where the cultivar used in the photos can be located?
  Last here is a picture of one of mine. Check out the trunk. Check out that graft! Pretty sweet huh? Not. The problem with this is my daughters bought this for me for father's day last year. The sweethearts didn't know. All they know is I love Hinoki Cypress. I'm not about to tell them it isn't the best material either. All that nastiness was buried in clay and burlap and couldn't be seen till I washed all of the nice clay off.
 Any way I'm going to try and make something of it and the tree is going to be with me forever as one of my most prized bonsai.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: buddhamonk on May 09, 2014, 12:44 PM
7 tree rock planting waiting for the "right rock"

(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y290/Buddhamonk1/bonsai%20private/bonsai/peanut-57_zps8f0e2573.jpg)

(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y290/Buddhamonk1/bonsai%20private/bonsai/peanut-58_zpse48b3914.jpg)
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: jlushious on May 09, 2014, 12:56 PM
Very cool, what kinds of trees are they?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: buddhamonk on May 09, 2014, 12:59 PM
Kingsville boxwoods
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Adair M on May 09, 2014, 02:12 PM
They grow about a 1/4 inch a year.  On a good year!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: buddhamonk on May 09, 2014, 02:22 PM
How old do you think this one might be? They do grow slowly =) this one hasn't changed at all in the 10 years I've had it

(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y290/Buddhamonk1/bonsai%20private/bonsai/peanut-56_zps6554bc3e.jpg)
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 10, 2014, 04:35 PM
That one is fairly old.  Hard to say. 
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on May 30, 2014, 02:21 PM
Little Jaime update
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on May 30, 2014, 03:20 PM
Nice.  It would be great if people updated existing threads or started new ones.  I've never seen Cham. obtusa 'Chabo-hiba' for sale.  You can get one if you donate a bunch if money to The Arnold Arboretum.....
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: andy graham on June 17, 2014, 06:59 PM
Green Island ficus 36" tall
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on June 17, 2014, 10:10 PM
I love this one Andy!

The aerial roots are amazingly perfect.

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Lordy on July 02, 2014, 02:48 PM
Not a lurker,  just a new poster (here).
Owen, we met at Meehan's last summer.  You saw this tree there and gave me some good tips on keeping it happy. 
Unfortunately, before I came to own the tree it had been kept against a house and not rotated, so is fairly 2-dimensional.  This spring at the PBA show in DC, Rodney Clemons persuaded me to rethink the tree's design, and thought it would make a good candidate for a partially blown-over tree as he saw growing up on the Gulf coast.  I swallowed hard and gave it a shot.  I is in a smaller cement mixing tub from HD, and now that I have covered the sphagnum on the rootage with wire mesh, the birds dont continually steal it for their nests.  I guess this will stay as is until next spring when I will have a look under the soil for roots on the trunk and branches.  If it works, it will be a bit of an unusual raft. 
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Adair M on July 02, 2014, 06:17 PM
Here's my shohin zelkova about two weeks ago when I defoliated it. And the second pic is today after watering. I've already cut back once after defoliating. Needs it again. And then another defoliation.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Herman on July 03, 2014, 03:56 AM
very nice tree, like the ginger ninja too  ;D
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on July 03, 2014, 08:44 PM
Not a lurker,  just a new poster (here).
Owen, we met at Meehan's last summer.  You saw this tree there and gave me some good tips on keeping it happy. 
Unfortunately, before I came to own the tree it had been kept against a house and not rotated, so is fairly 2-dimensional.  This spring at the PBA show in DC, Rodney Clemons persuaded me to rethink the tree's design, and thought it would make a good candidate for a partially blown-over tree as he saw growing up on the Gulf coast.  I swallowed hard and gave it a shot.  I is in a smaller cement mixing tub from HD, and now that I have covered the sphagnum on the rootage with wire mesh, the birds dont continually steal it for their nests.  I guess this will stay as is until next spring when I will have a look under the soil for roots on the trunk and branches.  If it works, it will be a bit of an unusual raft. 

Its working, and I love it!

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Lordy on July 03, 2014, 08:59 PM
Thanks, and thanks for the photo!  I guess I have seen trees growing from their new horizontal postion, but this really makes it more tangible, if that is the right word I'm looking for.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on July 04, 2014, 05:51 AM
My.... Lordy!  :D

I wish I had more photos of the better ones. I only took this photo cuz im pretty sure Ill never see this one again.

There are soooo many excellent ones to look at.

I like how it looks like yours grew that "low" little branch after it fell, as if it finally got enough light there to sprout. That makes it look, or rather, gives a timetable of sorts to the storm that blew it over. Looks about ten years ago now.

A bit more refinement...= $...looking forward to updates!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: 63pmp on August 12, 2014, 10:25 PM
Why I lurk; a response to the lurkers challenge. 

I've thought about this for a long time, sat on it for ages; why I lurk here at this site.  Somthing about that challenge set me to thinking.  I've been a member for over 4 years and this is my first post.  I visit nearly every day, so that would certainly qualify me as a lurker.  So why is it I've never bothered to say anything?. 

There are many reasons of course, ones that most will identify with.  These are the main ones.

Anxiety.  Posting seems to cause a lot of anxiety for me.

It takes a long time for me to type out something.  I was a poor English student at school, and as a consequence it takes me a long time to construct sentences, put out my thoughts in a logical sequence; let alone think of the right words to get my intentions across.  In my hectic world I don't have much spare time to reply to posts, so to take an hour out of the day to type something is a real luxury I can't often afford.

While I was a poor English student, I was an excellent biologist and chemist.  I completed an honors degree in soil chemistry from a well regarded university.  Worked in the field for awhile and now work in the allied health industry, as it pays better then science.  One my main problems is that I find it extremely difficult to explain complex biological processes simply.  And because they are complex people think its irrelevant; then there are the levellers (see below).  So I don't bother any more.

A lot of people who post here also post on other forums.  I don't agree with them there, and I don't agree with them here.  And as it's become respectful to allow other people there opinions, it has become disrespectful to question those opinions when they are wrong.  So I don't.

There are a few other reasons, like, as explained by William Golding in "The Princess Bride".  Australia is entirely populated by thieves and crooks.  The best way to maintain a collection is not to show it.  Anonymity, and a big dog, are your best friends.  So I rarely post photos anywhere.

I've posted on other forums, thought the rate of posting is dropping off to the point that I now rarely post anywhere.  I find that the boards are dominated by egoists, narcissists, or worse, a combination of both.  I find these people tiring, and as described by Andy Rutledge so long ago; levellers.  Levellers are those people that try and bring people down to their level.  Which really spoils a forum. If they do something that's good enough for them, everyone should be doing it that way.  They usually stymie variety, growth and intellectual discussion.  You only have to look at the thread about bonsai intensives on Bnut to see them at work.

Why do I visit if I don't wish to participate?  If you look at any forum, there is only ever about 30 people who actively participate, and hundreds that simply lurk, so the vast majority of users are lurkers; birds of a feather?.  I visit because I like to find challenges, to look for posts that either question my knowledge or beliefs, that are thought provoking, or actually have some useful information I have not encountered before. 

And I really don't need the anxiety that goes with posting opinions.

That's why I lurk here, and also why I hardly have a presence on any other forum now.  Sorry if that doesn't suite, but I thought an explanation would be nice for those that do post.

Paul

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Anthony on August 13, 2014, 03:24 AM
Hello Paul,

watch me muck up the soil / fertiliser topic - ha ha ha.

Very sorry you don't post more frequently, I always enjoy reading your comments, very educational.

On our side, it is also unwise to show too many images, or you may find your pots growing legs.
Good Day
Anthony
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Herman on August 13, 2014, 03:47 AM
Hi Paul,

then why did you cross the fence and risk anxiety to post this essay of yours? not trying to be rude, but I'm not so sure that Owen's thread here got you thinking so much that you just had to post an explanation of why you don't post. You kinda broke the ice here and let us know you have a wealth of knowledge to share....why share that with us if you plan on staying under the radar, and not share all that knowledge you studied so hard for, especially if you KNOW some of the information being posted is erroneous?

Man up Paul, anxiety to post? Come live in Africa for a bit and learn what true anxiety is like :) (said with good intentions)

If you don't want to post your trees then don't...that is your decision...no one else's...you don't need to provide trees as the evidence of the science you specialize in, now do you?

as for these 'levelers' you're talking about...why don't you just ignore them when they try to shove their opinions down your throat? it's not like the screen in front of you is going to headbutt you, the keyboard knock you on the kisser and the mouse strangle you if you do ignore the "levelers"...

then again if you truly have an anxiety disorder; rather lurk and be safe :)

kind regards
Herman
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 13, 2014, 06:56 AM
Paul..

 My real name is Mike. But my kids even call me Sorce. As does my wife.
But if I wanted to be anonymous, being this is the internet, I could be Sally from Boston. Or Fred from Nebraska.

  You can post a fake whole address, set up a camera there, and watch people show up to steal your trees! Then shoot at them if you wish! ;D just at them, not killshot!

Thieves are MORONS. Or they are stealing somethings way easier to sell at high dollar.(hermans diamond based clinker soil for example)  Not dead trees. ::)

Use a photo background that doesn't have a map to your garden, you'll be alright!

If its anxiety about your trees, just take a look at my post. First tree post. I just updated it. I had a little anxiety updating it. Overcome by an ounce of, I don't give a f*$k what people say!

I love people that post young or mediocre trees. Some folks understand growing a tree.

 Some people think we all should have  "finished" trees. Those Same people know no tree is finished, forgot theirs were seedlings too back when, forgot bonsai do not propogate themselves, and IMO should propogate themselves! (No one here is that bad, just had to try some more funny!)

  Try Africa, or Four kids with one small (no degrees) income. Bonsai is about releiving that tension. Remove the threat, and the anxiety will subside.

You could have wrote that twice as fast and it would have come out better still than most posts. Excellent post. However, it could be considered levelling itself...?

Id love to help you overcone you anxiety. Post a tree!

Sorce

 
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: bwaynef on August 13, 2014, 10:10 AM
Paul/63,

Thanks for the response.  Several of those reasons I've never considered.  Having trees of the quality of mine, I'm not much worried with them being taken.  (They're actually unprotected by fence as it is, to the chagrin of my neighbors.)  I can see how that'd be a real concern for quality trees though.

I think we'd all appreciate it if you'd jump in where you felt you could contribute though.  We don't have strict requirements that posts make sense.  (See John Kirby and his iPhone posts.)  It sounds like you'd have an interesting perspective on things as well as knowledge to share.

As far as levellers, the impetus behind this site was we wanted a place focused simply on bonsai.  That is, a place where we could come together and learn, and make our bonsai better.  I'm biased into thinking we've done a good job at fostering that environment, though we're open to suggestions on that front.  Its been my experience that when the focus is shifted from those with egos, to their trees and information, it is beneficial to everyone ...though that's a hard shift to make.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 13, 2014, 10:15 AM
This is the best place for real truth.

It would be nice to always see replies though.

You do have to put your own filter on! Being educated, this should be easy.

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 13, 2014, 02:19 PM
Paul, thank you for voicing your reasoning behind not posting.  I was taking the month off from posting here but your's hit home.  One way to achieve your goals would be to ask open-ended questions like the ones Yengling often poses here.  They seem to be the most productive.

At demonstrations and other club events, many people want to say something but fear they will risk showing ignorance in a group of their peers. This site gives some the chance to open up.

This forum seems to have the least amount of ego and levelers.  My intent was to increase the post count.  The backlog of information on here has been helpful to me and many others. 

I'd recommend a pseudonym to post, turn off your location function in your photos EVERYONE SHOULD DO THIS, and keep any posts you feel inclined to write clear on your intentions. 

A high quantity of lurkers is what it is; people interested in increasing their enjoyment and understanding of bonsai quietly.  Whether you ever post or not is immaterial as long as the site here is beneficial to your pursuit IMO.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: GBHunter on August 13, 2014, 04:34 PM
Pardon my ignorance but what is a Lurker in this context?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Adair M on August 13, 2014, 05:16 PM
Paul,

As the author of the thread on Intensives on B'Nut, I know EXACTLY what you're talking about with the "Levelers"!  I really don't understand their attitude:  I'm giving details about what I learned at the Intensive class, and they say things like, "I can't afford to go, it's for elitists, only elitists have really refined bonsai, so I'm not going to listen to what you have to say, because, I'm not an elitist like you..." And then they go on to try to put words in my mouth, saying that I called them all kinds of names which I never did.  I just said there are better, more effective ways to do what they were trying to do...  Geesh!  I actually had to call out one guy for using profane language.  I do believe he did go back and edit his post to remove it.

I, too, am somewhat reluctant to post photos for the reasons you stated.

This site, in my opinion, has a greater percentage of experienced bonsai practitioners than others, and so I find the info posted here to be of higher quality than other sites.  Of course, beginners are welcome here, and questions are always welcome, too.


All that said,  I am very appreciative of Wayne, Matsu, Kirby, and the others that make this site what it is.  The posts presented here, and I went and read every post on pines, tridents and Japanese Maples when I first found this site, inspired me to raise the level at which I was performing.

And that's how it should be.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 13, 2014, 09:21 PM
Pardon my ignorance but what is a Lurker in this context?

A lurker is someone who reads posts but rarely or never posts
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Anthony on August 14, 2014, 06:37 AM
Actually, from reading Paul's posts for while now, I get the idea that he might be tired of our approach to the topic of soil, much the same way my brother-in-law as a traditional Fine Artist gets tired of the approach to Design in bonsai.

As a science, soil treatment in bonsai, is often non-existent, and very impersonal through the use of a hose for watering.

One set follows Akadama, which as far as research showed, is just a leftover of Japanese farming practices, with cores of the trees returning to clay.

Another follows a modified Hydroponic practice, pumping fertiliser, and probably developing tons of inflated plant tissue.

Yet another tries to follow Organic farming, which can be very intensive and not a hobby joy.

Then there are variations of the above.

Seems that some heads need to get together and write the Encyclopaedia of Bonsai.

By the way, since we have the experience of growing in up to zone 7 and the tropics, the trees that cross over use the same soil. In other words it's the grower that is making the difference, not the plant or the weather.

Celtis L, grows in the same soil, in Philadelphia, London, Florence and San Fernando, as do quite a few other trees, we have had the joy to grow. Save we need a refrigerator in San Fernando.
Expect the same with J.B.pines, save they cannot be imported into Trinidad. Only seed is allowed.So no research can be done there.
Good Day
Anthony

* So what if we discover that all trees can be grow in 3mm to 5mm rounded inorganic particles [ absorbent or not ] and compost, with a weak fertiliser or spoons of enriched compost.
Only those who study with us, are probably going to use the information.

Of course as in Oil painting technique is considerably less of an achievement, than the actual finished effort [ The Painting ].
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: bwaynef on August 14, 2014, 08:27 AM
Actually, from reading Paul's posts for while now, I get the idea that he might be tired of our approach to the topic of soil, much the same way my brother-in-law as a traditional Fine Artist gets tired of the approach to Design in bonsai.

As a science, soil treatment in bonsai, is often non-existent, and very impersonal through the use of a hose for watering.

One set follows Akadama, which as far as research showed, is just a leftover of Japanese farming practices, with cores of the trees returning to clay.

Another follows a modified Hydroponic practice, pumping fertiliser, and probably developing tons of inflated plant tissue.

Yet another tries to follow Organic farming, which can be very intensive and not a hobby joy.

Then there are variations of the above.

Seems that some heads need to get together and write the Encyclopaedia of Bonsai.

By the way, since we have the experience of growing in up to zone 7 and the tropics, the trees that cross over use the same soil. In other words it's the grower that is making the difference, not the plant or the weather.

Celtis L, grows in the same soil, in Philadelphia, London, Florence and San Fernando, as do quite a few other trees, we have had the joy to grow. Save we need a refrigerator in San Fernando.
Expect the same with J.B.pines, save they cannot be imported into Trinidad. Only seed is allowed.So no research can be done there.
Good Day
Anthony

* So what if we discover that all trees can be grow in 3mm to 5mm rounded inorganic particles [ absorbent or not ] and compost, with a weak fertiliser or spoons of enriched compost.
Only those who study with us, are probably going to use the information.

Of course as in Oil painting technique is considerably less of an achievement, than the actual finished effort [ The Painting ].


Anthony, do I summarize your post correctly:  First you start off with some assumption as to Paul's feelings regarding soil.  Then you liken that to your bro-in-law's tiring of discussing design.  Then ...after making allowances for Paul already being tired of soil posts, you go into a diatribe about soil without really taking any side ...except that it may not be important what soil gets used.

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: coh on August 14, 2014, 10:22 AM
It's always risky to try and speak for someone else. That said...I've been interacting with Paul for a few years on other forums (bnut and IBC). Most of his posts are about water quality and nutrient use/fertilization. Hopefully he'll correct me if I get any of this wrong, but he had to deal with poor quality water which created all kinds of nutrient problems in his trees. He has extensively studied modern research on the whole issue of fertilization, water quality, nutrient use, and has shared a lot of this information on the forums. Some of it is very technical, and some of it contradicts some of the basic assumptions we've been operating under for years...such as the idea that plants only take up "what they need" so you can basically fertilize with any kind of fertilizer. Research shows that if you apply too much of a certain nutrient, you can actually block uptake of others, and these kinds of effects can be modulated by soil pH which is in turn affected by water alkalinity, etc. It can get very complicated.

Now, with that in mind...I think it's pretty obvious that most of the time, for most people, water quality is not a major concern. Most of us have municipal sources that are at least adequate and don't require acidification or use of specialized fertilizers. Most can get away with using "whatever is on sale" (to paraphrase Walter Pall), most of us don't have to worry about how much of the nitrogen is urea versus ammonium versus nitrate.

However - most doesn't cover everyone. Some municipal sources are "dirty", as are many wells. So in my opinion, it is good to have his information available on the forums. I may not need it now, but perhaps down the line my plants will start to decline or I'll move someplace where the water is not as good. Then the information Paul has provided may turn out to be a lifesaver.

As you might expect with any information that is "new", Paul has taken a fair bit of flak along the way. There are certain individuals who have been on the forums for a while, who belittle what he has to say...referring to it as "gobbity-gook", tinkering, and other disparaging comments. I think most of us just ignore those kinds of comments but unfortunately it seems to bother Paul. Perhaps people here would be more accepting...perhaps not. Paul, maybe you should start a thread here sharing what you've learned and see how people respond.

By the way, the thread that Paul referred to on bnut, started by Adair, was one of the most informative I've seen there in a while. It did have some of the typical bnut "garbage" but I find that easy to read past.

Chris
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: jlushious on August 14, 2014, 10:37 AM
I would be interested in a water quality discussion, we have really hard water here in Calgary and I am wondering if it is affecting my trees. On some of my trees that I used black lava on I see a white residue building up (I see it mostly on the black lava, but it's probably on all my trees) that I am guessing is from the water - but I have no idea what it is.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Anthony on August 14, 2014, 11:01 AM
bwaynef,

What side can I take ?

If it grows and is healthy, isn't that what you want?
If there is a problem say some 30 to 60 years down the road, someone else will most probably fix it, if the tree is alive.

How would I compare notes, is there anyone else moving back and forth through the zones growing the same trees?
Isn't that the problem, no way to check various experiences?
Good Day
Anthony
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: bwaynef on August 14, 2014, 12:23 PM
What side can I take ?

I'm not asking you to take a side.  I find it peculiar that you identify a subject that you suspect Paul is loathe to continue discussing ...and make that the focus of the rest of your lengthy post, which happens to not have much to do with the rest of this thread.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Anthony on August 14, 2014, 04:12 PM
Perhaps BWaynef,

I was hoping to catch Paul's eye, and encourage him to post his learned thoughts.
Here and in the Fertiliser topic.
Good Day
Anthony
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: augustine on August 15, 2014, 10:14 AM
The beauty of this forum is that a number of trained and experienced practitioners freely share their knowledge. Also, BSG has minimal foolishness and negativity. Lots of nice people interested in advancing the art of bonsai.

Thanks to all and keep up the good work.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 21, 2014, 08:13 PM
OK Owen,
I am a poor photographer and only have a cell phone, but here are some backyard pictures of some projects:

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 21, 2014, 09:58 PM
Have you photographed your junipers over time?  It would be great for you to start a new thread showing their progress.  Or, you could start one now and post updates (trials, triumphs, lessons learned, etc). 

Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 22, 2014, 12:33 AM
I do have some older pics. Nothing chronological but I will see if I can put one or two progressions together. I will try to take better current pics as well.
Tona
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: jlushious on August 22, 2014, 07:43 AM
Really digging the third pic, the boxwood, the trunk/nebari looks great!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 23, 2014, 01:14 AM
Thanks jlushious,
I am looking for a pot for that tree. It's pretty big so I may have to save up for the pot.
Tona
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Chrisl on August 23, 2014, 12:40 PM
I haven't posted much this yr as most of my stuff is simply growing this yr.  What I have been doing quite a bit of this summer is cleaning of live veins on a couple rmj's.  My gosh, is it so much harder than one would imagine...getting the bark off without cutting into the vein!  I'm slowly getting better, but still cutting into the vein way too much.  I'm very happy that I bought a couple of cheap 'practice' rmj's to practice on.

I can post some pics, but not much to see..
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wirem,e on August 23, 2014, 01:10 PM
Here's a lurkers tree then. :). Collected 2011, very rough initial styling a couple days ago.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 23, 2014, 04:13 PM
Also cool IMO  ;D.  How long will you let the left side of the canopy drop in the future?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wirem,e on August 23, 2014, 05:06 PM
Depends on what I find when I repot next spring. Here's a shot showing more of the box, if memory serves correctly  I may have exposed trunk\root as far as the upper board giving lots of room to drop foliage. Another pic shows into the end of the main lower right branches. Definitely I want to create separation there and that could further lower the right side.

I actually didn't mean to style the tree, I started by jinning a branch then couldn't stop. I only own 2 gauges of aluminum wire if I had a better selection I'd have tried to refine further I guess.

Your thoughts on dropping the  canopy on the left?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 23, 2014, 05:24 PM
Mainly just curious about where the dead wood in the back is going.  Looks interesting.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wirem,e on August 23, 2014, 05:34 PM
This tree has a lot of interesting deadwood features, hard to showcase them all. I initially placed the branch behind that bit of wood but didn't like it there. I thought to thin the foliage covering it later. Maybe I don't need any of the foliage lower than the apex on the left, might have a nice diagonal flow then?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 23, 2014, 09:17 PM
This is my Chinese Elm. It is 28 inches tall from the soil and 32 inches wide at the widest point. I don't have a real current picture but I am taking it to my teacher on Thursday and will take a picture after I work on it. The first picture is from the 2013 Winter Silhouette Show at the Los Angeles Arboretum. The second is from the 2013 Sansui Kai show about 6 months later.
Enjoy!!
Tona
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Josh on August 23, 2014, 10:29 PM
Really cool elm Tona!

Any possibility planting angle could be shifted to the left and brought forward a touch to improve transition to soil line?  It would obviously change the trunk line to the left, just an idea to improve this great tree.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 24, 2014, 12:02 AM
Maybe in the future. It was re-potted in March of this year. I did lean it a bit more forward, but that was about all that was done.
Tona
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SHIMA1 on August 25, 2014, 04:40 AM
OK, here's a shohin pyracantha progression from  dreadful roots to a new beginning in 3 months.
It's a bit more relaxed now and full of green berries.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on August 25, 2014, 07:56 AM
Nice pyracantha Shima!  Good move on the layer, huge improvement.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Adair M on August 25, 2014, 10:45 AM
Agree with BVF!  Well done!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Josh on August 25, 2014, 09:11 PM
Nice job, really well done!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: LarryT on August 26, 2014, 12:09 AM
Impressed with the technique, and results!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 26, 2014, 05:59 AM
Very nice Shim steak sauce!  ;D
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SHIMA1 on August 28, 2014, 01:51 AM
Thanks BVF, Adair, Josh and Larry.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on August 28, 2014, 07:37 AM
One for the pile...zelkova caught my eye from a distance at this angle, and it made for a decent photo.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SHIMA1 on August 28, 2014, 05:46 PM
Wonderful! Just the right amount of tension.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on August 28, 2014, 08:58 PM
Brian, that should have been at te Nashille show.  Nice container.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on August 28, 2014, 11:35 PM
Brian, that should have been at te Nashille show.  Nice container.
Thanks...I promise to bring trees next year; though you weren't lacking any in talent there!

That container is a slab-built one by Byron Myrick.  Years ago I commissioned it after an antique Cantonese pot from the book Classic Bonsai of Japan (tree #3).  He made three pots; one cracked in the kiln, and this one had the most approximate glaze.  I could wish for more green and less gold through the center panel, but he does good work and is always improving.

Here's the hawthorn dressed and ready for a trip to NY...
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 29, 2014, 05:17 AM
Dam.

  Now that one looks fantastic.

Same muscle trunk as another thread yes?

It is looking very good now. I love the visual of the trunks through the canopy.

This is one of my favorite trees ever! ;D

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Chrisl on August 29, 2014, 11:57 AM
I agree Sorce, one of my favorites, just a wonderful trunk and canopy.  But Brian, what's up w. the golf tees?  Been practicing your chip shots?? ;))
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 29, 2014, 12:57 PM
Golf courses are for night fishing!  ;)
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SHIMA1 on August 29, 2014, 03:24 PM
A very unique hawthorn.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Tona on August 29, 2014, 08:21 PM
Beautiful Hawthorn!!
Tona
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 30, 2014, 03:49 AM
Friend at work loves this tree too!

Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on August 30, 2014, 07:42 AM
what's up w. the golf tees?
Keeps the birdies away...well actually the screen does, tees just keep the screen up off the soil a bit.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: M. Frary on August 30, 2014, 08:09 AM
Golf courses are for night fishing!  ;)
  Hear! Hear! A lot of Hydrilla Gorillas live in golf course ponds! On my way to a place tomorrow where the Smallmouth get 7 pounds.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Chrisl on August 30, 2014, 08:57 AM
what's up w. the golf tees?
Keeps the birdies away...well actually the screen does, tees just keep the screen up off the soil a bit.

Good idea Brian.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on August 31, 2014, 06:25 AM
Birds hate golf too!

BVF. This has its own thread? Id love to see the progression. I know ive seen it with bigger leaves. You got them down nice. Care to share how?

this IS my favorite tree  :D

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Brian Van Fleet on August 31, 2014, 08:12 AM
BVF. This has its own thread? Id love to see the progression. I know ive seen it with bigger leaves. You got them down nice. Care to share how?

Sorce

I did a detailed progression over at Bnut, don't have the photos with me to do another one at the moment.
http://bonsainut.com/forums/showthread.php?5761-Collected-Hawthorn-History (http://bonsainut.com/forums/showthread.php?5761-Collected-Hawthorn-History)
Leaf size...they've always been pretty small, but decent ramification and 100% full sun helps.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: raydomz on September 03, 2014, 09:31 PM
Long time lurker - I plan to create a thread for this shohin common juniper but figured I'd share the results of its first styling.
Thanks! 

(http://i.imgur.com/lnNBSk3.jpg)
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Jason E on September 04, 2014, 06:17 PM
Start that new thread Randomz. tell some more.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: raydomz on September 04, 2014, 07:55 PM
You got it!

Will put it up now.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on September 05, 2014, 05:44 AM
Oh..  luRker! Not luNker!  ;)

  Sorry I had to! Des Plaines river smallmouth!

  The Maple in the background is what I hope to style my Amur after.
As it already juts out to the side, and has a bud ready to pop and form the canopy.

  C'mon lurkers!

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: mc4mc44 on September 19, 2014, 12:42 PM
My Japanese Larch, i had it since it was a seedling.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on September 20, 2014, 05:08 AM
Mc4mc44.

Couple things. Why Mc4mc44? I just have to know!

I would be proud as hell of this tree. From a seedling, I love what you've done with it. It is so graceful, beautifully feminine.

Thoughts on a more feminine pot?

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: bwaynef on September 21, 2014, 06:46 AM
This last one's character isn't truly revealed until you click for the larger picture.  It was much more interesting than I thought it was going to be.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: izk_zero on September 28, 2014, 12:38 AM
Here are some photos from brussel's in mississippi. They were having their fall sale so I had to get by there and look for a good deal. I ended up with a little ginkgo, will post pictures tomorrow with better lighting.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on September 28, 2014, 10:13 AM
Here is an update on my 'little jaime'
This species is a feisty grower.
I pinch it back and in two weeks it has already grown out.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: berobinson82 on October 09, 2014, 12:14 PM
Sure, I'll play. Here's a little shohin berberis that has been in training for 1 year.

Before and after.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Owen Reich on October 09, 2014, 11:30 PM
Thanks for playing  ;D.  Looks like a great start.  It would be wonderful for all the players to start a new thread on this forum and update it when possible.  The # of views and posts on this thread have been excellent.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on February 10, 2015, 05:54 AM
New posts are getting 4k+ views in one day! :o

2-3 replies by the same people..... ???

The silence is so, I can hear mites crawling on my trees!  :-\

Now the posters are lurkers.....

What the blood clot? (That was for spongeman) who, by the way, should watch the Wu video in Bjorns series if he hasn't already!

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Anthony on February 10, 2015, 07:08 AM
Sorce,

you have the most amazing way of communicating, such imagery. I may not always get it thoroughly, but it is more than worth the time taken to open and read.
Keep it up!!

Winter is normally sleepy time for folk on your side, and our side it is repotting, hoping to finish before 26th February. The house has the yard on that side in deep Northern shadow, and temperatures are hanging around 66 to 68 deg.F. Some breeze, and it is drying out for our version of the Desert, until say June.

Our humidity will stabilise around 45 to 50% and by night back to 60 %. The ocean surrounding blocks our getting drier.

Nothing is growing.

A little about height in the Tropics -

0 to 3000 feet is called Terra Caliente.

3000 to 6000 feet is called Terra Templada

6000 and upwards is Terra Fria

So Jamaica has frost and strawberries on her mountains.
Trinidad can only get cold, like Caracas in Venezuela at 3000 feet.
BUT the German village above Caracas is in snow.

Enough said.
Remember - oil cake [ rapeseed ] composted -> fertiliser cakes -> with more decomposition is Humus -> then onto metal oxides etc. Thanks to Al Keppler.
Good Day
Anthony
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SpongeMann on February 18, 2015, 10:04 PM
This thread is great!  Owen .The trees are crazy. I hope everyone keeps  participating. I want to bring up the  Paul's  comment last year in August on this thread. When I became a member to B.S.G. and started browsing the forum and I noticed the beautiful trees. I immediately thought that I was out of my league .I had just given away all my pre worked bonsai and my box store bonsai. I wanted to work my bonsai from the start.  I decided I will just work on collected material for a few years All I had /have is projects. I wondered how everyone would react to my posts of my collected natives and invasive Trees. I am a headstrong, head up, chest out kinda guy. So I started posts on my projects. And I am glad I did. I know I don't get many comments but, thank you guys and girls that do. I feel accepted by members and  experienced artists on the forum even though I am new to bonsai. I just wanted to put that out there for the lurkers who want to participate but don't for whateva reason lol.I don't have bonsai pots or nice bonsai yet. And no one cares. I just have love for the art  and the trees. And that's what they care about. So participate people start by adding a pic to this thread .Owen your awesome and Sorce you too mann. Yeah Sorce I had already seen the video. Im a subscriber to his page . But that video is Crazy !That is by far my favorite video on YouTube!  He killed it!!
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Sorce on February 20, 2015, 06:32 AM
Anthony.

I remember you saying how you read these posts like continual conversations or something like that, I do to, even across forums, here,NUT, and IBC.

So you probably get me more than most folks. !

I do love it here and sincerely miss the activity.

Thanks Sponge,
 for the output of thoughts on the lurker posting topic!
You and Dorian are the only ones keeping things going here!

Owen......I am dying to know why.....I forget his name....looked so tired that morning.
That line could go so many ways.....

Summer 2013 I took pictures all the time. 2014. Too much work! 10% of the pictures from2013.
2015 is going to be very interesting.  A lot of projects to share! I'll do my best!

Sunkist Metal Oxides. !

Sorce
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 20, 2015, 02:05 PM
Thanks Sorce. I love this forum and I have definitely learnt so much already and plan to learn much more.

I understand that it must be hard for a forum to keep activity high due to many people asking the same questions over and over again(and the regulars getting tired of repeating themselves). But I agree that it would be great to see more activity.

So the lurkers out there, take the plunge and post a thread. Oh heck post here. Just post.

I'll post one or 2 of my "projects" tomorrow.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 21, 2015, 03:32 AM
Ok, I'm not a lurker but I like this thread

I planted this Ficus Thonningii (Well I think it is a Thonningii) as a root over rock in 2008.  My dad brought me a seedling

I think it has done ok.  These images were taken in November 2014.  Since then the top has grown considerably and actually in need of a trim.

Also it is still in a deep pot to assist with the growth.  In spring (sept 2015) I will start removing soil so that the roots can harden up and ultimately plant in a shallower pot.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SpongeMann on February 22, 2015, 07:25 PM
No problem Sorce. I appreciate the shout out too. It brought me to this creative thread and I look forward to seeing your projects . Dorian I like the tree. Do you have anything planned for the stub left from a cut. You should try to get some roots to grow from there and wrap around to the left.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 23, 2015, 01:25 AM
Do you have anything planned for the stub left from a cut. You should try to get some roots to grow from there and wrap around to the left.
Hi Sponge

Not too sure which area you are referring to on this.

I have included pictures taken today of how the growth has been.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 23, 2015, 01:41 AM
and the final 2
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SpongeMann on February 23, 2015, 10:10 AM
I'm sorry D. I don't know what happened. I guess I didn't look at the tree as close as I thought. The roots are just fine. It is holding on to that rock s kung fu with it's kung fu grip  roots. Lol
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 23, 2015, 10:14 AM
LOL.  No problem.

Yeah it is pretty much secured to that rock.  Loads of small aerial roots coming out from right at the top so trying to keep it wet and humid to get them to take.  I might push is some wet cotton into the gaps and see if that will help?  Really do not want to bury the whole rock again.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Don Blackmond on February 23, 2015, 12:25 PM
Base & nebari, work in progress...
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Adair M on February 23, 2015, 02:12 PM
Looking good, Don. What is that, zelkova?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on February 24, 2015, 01:44 AM
Great start for the nebari Don

Do you have a pic of the tree?
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: SpongeMann on February 28, 2015, 11:10 PM
What's up fellas Dorian cotton works but When I tried it green mold grew all over the cotton. I recommend  Sphagnum moss. It worked a lot better .I m only using it for airlayers at the moment.   Don you got some good roots going there. What kind of medium are you using for root ramification? I get really good results with sharp sand, pumice and a little bit of compost.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: Leo in NE Illinois on March 11, 2015, 06:14 PM
A shohin JBP cork bark I picked up in 2013. It was bare rooted in shipping, as a result of the shock, no significant new growth in 2013, so I let it grow for 2014 without any pruning or candle work. There is a cluster of branches coming out at one spot up high, I will reduce it to one. This is a long term work in progress, don''t want to do much to it until I see vigorous growth. So I might not do anything for 2015 either.

I like being able to see the cork bark, so I may let it move to the next size above shohin.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on March 30, 2015, 08:15 AM
Here is a boxwood I've had for several years.
Hope you like it.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: wlambeth on March 30, 2015, 08:18 AM
Here's some after photos of my boxwood.
Title: Re: Lurker Challenge !!!
Post by: DorianJF on March 30, 2015, 08:21 AM
Good to see and thanks for posting.

I have a boxwood that I have to airlayer come spring so definitely looking forward to that.