Author Topic: Texas Cedar Elm...  (Read 6173 times)

Kajukid

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Texas Cedar Elm...
« on: August 31, 2011, 07:47 PM »
been looking throught this site and havent seen anythin about a Texas Cedar Elm...anyone ever worked with one before?? i have one, i really like it...i like the branches and the bark...i know that 2 of the branches arent suitable for Bonsai, but oh well, i like them...i have 2 of them...and i had a bug problem for a while and it came out to be Leaf Miners...ugh damn things...so i had to cut off all the leafs that had the miners on them...but heres a pic of it...
 

Kajukid

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2011, 07:48 PM »
2
 

Kajukid

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2011, 10:07 PM »
2
 

Kajukid

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2011, 10:08 PM »
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Elliott

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2011, 12:42 AM »
Hi
 Nice start! I have a cascade style ceder elm that has beened trained as a bonsai for a long time from a little whip like yours. Treat it like any other elm except that these guys like some humidity. I think you will be fine where you live in the bay area.
 Where I live (inland Los Angeles area) it is very hot and dry. The tree loves heat, but I have the pot on a piece of indoor/outdoor carpeting, so after I water, the carpet dries out much slower and releases moisture into the area around the tree especialy the very ramified, thin branching at the tips which is very suseptible to drying out.
 They are nice and fairly easy trees. Get with someone with experience and use a very diluted dormant tree spray on it this winter after it has lost it leaves. This should help you with any pests in the spring. I like using the Bayer 3 in1 rose and garden liquid or granules on my trees. It works for most problems.
Thanks
 

Mitch Thomas

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2011, 12:05 PM »
Hello to all.
I am new here on Bonsai Study Group.

Kajukid
I have a large cedar elm I have been working on for about 4/5yrs. I find it a very easy tree to work with. They are not fussy about water quality (mine is terrible). They are very thirsty trees in the summer time just about impossible to over water them. I find they like a sandy clay based potting medium. They can take as much heat as I can throw at them. They also air layer easily. I use the Bayer systemic in the spring and have no bug problems. They can also take a lot of wind with no leaf burn.
There seems to be a couple of different crosses of this specie and winged elm. Mine shows traces of this.

 

rockm

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2011, 02:21 PM »
I've had collected cedar elms for over 20 years now and have collected a few myself.

They are among my favorite species for bonsai. They grow rapidly and strongly, can be pruned mercilessly and for the most part are very healthy trees. Bugs are rarely a problem. I have never applied insecticide to mine in the last 15 years or so. Even tent worms don't bother them around here. Test insecticides on an inconspicuous area of the tree before applying it over the entire plant. Elms can be sensitive to some.

It is NOT impossible to overwater them. If you give them too much water and have improper soil, expect problems. They can suffer from root rot and black spot disease if kept too wet. They are also susceptible to winter die back if things stay too wet and cold in the winter.

They don't "love" heat. They can tolerate high temps --anything above 90 or so in full sun in a pot can crisp leaves over a summer. Partial shade is appreciated in mid-summer. Higher summer nightime temps can also induce summer dormancy, which means the tree will become stubborn in putting out new growth and reluctant to take up water. It just sits...until the weather gets better. You have to watch the watering during these "inactive" spells and know what they are.

The species tends to get corky wings on some growth, however, it has nothing to do with cross breeding with winged elm. Cedar elm in its natural habitat regularly has corky growth on twigs. On a full-sized tree, it's not noticeable.

They can take just about any decent bonsai soil mix.
 

Mitch Thomas

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2011, 04:01 PM »


I must be lucky then with mine. Here in south Louisiana the weather is either hot or wet or both. I would say we had a hot summer here with many days over 100 deg. And averaging in the high 90,s .My trees are in full sun all day with 0 shade. As long as I keep them watered they thrive. I don't use any organic in my soil mix, that is probably why I never have had any die back or root rot. After leaf fall and temps lower watering must be adjusted, just like all bonsai.
Being so hot and wet makes for a very aggressive bug population that must be kept in check.


You can believe a stressed tree will be  attacked first no matter where you live.

From asking around here most local bonsaist have informed me that in areas where the two species over lap is where the cedar elm/ winged elm crosses. From what they tell me the crossed trees grow much faster than the true cedar elms. You may have a different take on it.

All of this is what I have learned and practice on my cedar elms.

Mitch



 

Kajukid

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2011, 10:55 AM »
thanks guys...yeah i had some rust problem with one of them...i had to cut the most of the leaves off and it grew back really fast. i also notice that when fly land on the leaves, they leave these black dot on it., i dont know what it is...i alos had a problem with leaf miners(from flys) the flys seem to really like my elm trees, i have a couple of Chinese Elm's(ugh, dman fly, i hate them..)..i want to work on ramafication and get some of the branches thicker...and as far as the soil goes, its mostly inorganic (red lava rock, decomposed granite, pumice, with a lil organic compost in it) so it drains really well, i water all my tree 2 times a day(if its hot) once in the morning before the sun is even gets around my trees and one more time late in the after noon around 5-6pm....after 2 years, i think Im gonna switch over to Boon's mix....but thanks for the help guys....

oh, one last thing....since i cut most of the leafs off, all the new leafs a really big,....how do i stop that?? i want them small...they get about 5 hours of sun a day, unless its really hot then i put some shade over them...
 

rockm

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Re: Texas Cedar Elm...
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2011, 01:38 PM »
"From asking around here most local bonsaist have informed me that in areas where the two species over lap is where the cedar elm/ winged elm crosses. From what they tell me the crossed trees grow much faster than the true cedar elms. You may have a different take on it."
 
Unless there is genetic proof in a clinical study or two, my take on it would be that corky growth doesn't necessarily mean a cross breeding issue with another species, although it might happen. Cedar elm simply produces corky growth on some twigs. That characteristic translates into the rougher bark that CE develops as it matures. I collect in areas where both species occur.

I hesitate to use completely inorganic soil with this species as it lives in lowlands near streams, or at least what USED to be streams in Texas where I collect it ;D. It likes moist soil. It is a very drought tolerant species though. Additional organics in the mix can also help the tree along through our winters here in Va. Inorganic soils tend to dry out under mulch in winter winds. Dry roots are more susceptible to winter kill than roots that are kept moist. Water around roots and in the soil freezes before water in roots and can insulate roots to some extent in cold weather.

Cutting off leaves can lead to larger replacement leaves. That usually happens on areas of the tree that are growing more strongly than the rest. This can be an apically dominant species, so stronger growth usually occurs at the top. Sun exposure can controlled pruning can make leaves smaller and growth tighter.