Author Topic: acacia nigrescens winter image  (Read 7994 times)

J.Kent

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2014, 10:42 AM »
Quote
You don't want this to end up looking like a pine.

Agree 100 percent.  This looks like a bonsai, not a tree.

Doesn't work for me, either.  The "daughter" tree bends too slowly; it needs some sudden movement.  Cut off most of the foliage and let an outside branch take over as top. 

Eliminate the main pointy top to just above the new daughter tree height and again let some side branches fight for dominance as the top.  These trees NEED to be flat tops.  Get Ceronio's "Bonsai Styles of the World."
 

Herman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2014, 03:49 AM »
Quote
You don't want this to end up looking like a pine.

Agree 100 percent.  This looks like a bonsai, not a tree.

Doesn't work for me, either.  The "daughter" tree bends too slowly; it needs some sudden movement.  Cut off most of the foliage and let an outside branch take over as top. 

Eliminate the main pointy top to just above the new daughter tree height and again let some side branches fight for dominance as the top.  These trees NEED to be flat tops.  Get Ceronio's "Bonsai Styles of the World."

you are one of those that believe a species should only be trained in bonsai as they look in nature, aren't you?

your post would've been more believable if you knew how these grow in nature...It's okay that my tree does not work for you, taste differs after all...compare the first sketch to the two others, and then look at my tree again...

kind regards
Herman
 

Herman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2014, 03:51 AM »
the other two pics
 

VanceWood

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2014, 08:21 AM »
There are a lot of options and choices as your drawings illustrate.  There is also something else that should be considered-----what do you see in the tree?  That really is the important thing not if it fits into the style box of crap that has come before.   If I had listened to all of the naysayers over the years I would not be doing Mugo Pines today.  I would be producing the same boring trees in the same boring ways as they do. 

It is nice to have suggestions and opinions so that you can examine your work through someone else's eyes and points of view but---- do you approve of their designs and the way they do things?  So often we cower under the bite of someone's criticism not realizing that the critic does not do their own work and cannot do their own stuff without help.  I just point that out to you because it is a lesson I just recently learned to my own amazement.
 

fredman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2014, 03:29 PM »
Very true. I deal with that regularly. Crying foul will not improve my trees. We can only become better Bonsaists by the critique of others. One don't have to change ones design but hopefully it makes you look at it through different eyes, and opens up some other options. Its up to you to evaluate and do what sooths your soul.
If you in the end feel truly satisfied with your design, then that is all that matters.
This tree is going the pyramid pine way and in the finish it will just be another bonsai. All the power of a typical Acacia will be lost....... :(
 

Herman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2014, 08:54 AM »
A few being trained in pierneef or flat top style, there are more of these

Kind regards
Herman
 

fredman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2014, 07:25 PM »
WoW you are the man Herman. Thanks for showing them. Now you can send me a tissue  :'(
Paperbark, Monkey ...?
 

fredman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2014, 08:55 PM »
What makes Acacia so special is those thorns. Different looking thorns on different species. Tortillis with two different thorn shapes in one is very special to me. What is also very interesting is the long thorns has round flowers, and the short thorns has long flowers. Thorns makes a fantastic feature in a bonsai.....! 
Did you know Acacia in Greek means thorn? Makes me wonder Why African Acacia is now Senegal and Australian's Acacia..... Aussie Acacia don't even have thorns but they are called by that name.... Crazy  Bureaucrats  >:(
 

Herman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #23 on: October 29, 2014, 12:48 AM »
WoW you are the man Herman. Thanks for showing them. Now you can send me a tissue  :'(
Paperbark, Monkey ...?

Hi Fredman,

Black, white monkey thorn, blue tjorn and knob thorn. Planting scented thorn, robust thorn and camel thorn seeds in a few months

Tears of happyness? Dude....  :-\

I'm going to make you eat you piramid pine words with the knob thorn in this thread...I never planned on making the ttree a pine style. Knob thorn just grows that way when young because of the shoots extending too far for the tree to keep it upwards, you get that with young black monkey thorn as well...aiming for bushveld style which may be seen as a variant of the classic moyogi style, the primary branches would be going sideways and maybe a bit downwards with the secondaries going up....

Here is a pic of a very young black monkey thorn I've never touched to prove it



Kind regards
Herman
 

fredman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2014, 03:49 PM »
Mate I will gladly eat my words for the sake of that tree. I believe your intentions. I over reacted when I saw that pointy top and the drawn down branches. My bad then.
No its tears of sadness. When I left 10 years ago I had to get rid of my Acacias. I gave them all away to people that will appreciate them. I had 25 different varieties. I just had a tissue moment for them...... :(
Blue thorn (Blouhaak) is one of my favourites. They are stunning when matured. Has the most beautiful thorns to.
Do you have the "driedoring"?
I have always wondered if you plant a camel thorn (or any other flat top or umbrella Acacia) in a pot. Remove its tap root and leave it without training it. Because of its genetics, will it end up looking like they do in nature when matured in that pot?
 

Herman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2014, 12:29 AM »
You mean the small bushes in the kalahari and richters veld and karoo that's called drie doring? Did not know it's used for bonsai, must be hardcto get them to trunk up? I'm experimenting with red and brown ivory and pod and mountain mahogany also snotbas and gwarry bos.

Maybe one can try such an experiment with the acacia's that bushes early on like black monke, knob and robust thorn. The idea would be to completely leave them alone until it has bushed up to the point where you will have a lot to work with.

Like this young black monkey thorn...was trunk chopped early on to create movement in the trunk then left to grow for a year. Going to wire it next august.
 

Jason E

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2014, 07:35 PM »
Looks like your working w/ some pretty neat species there Herman, Thanks for sharing. That last looks promising.

JE
 

fredman

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Re: acacia nigrescens winter image
« Reply #27 on: November 03, 2014, 08:53 PM »
Wow mate there is an endless array of trees that can be used in that country. You must really appretiate it. Its unique is so many ways..... :)
Herman the Drie doring is the Acacia Senegal var. rostrata and Acacia senegal var. leiorhachis. They can be bonsaied in an African style. I had the Rostata and its something special because of the unusual thorns. Three on a node all mostly rectangular. It makes a beautiful feature on the tree. They grow in the north east of Southern Africa.
 I got mine from Patryshoek Nursery on the De Wildt/ Brits road. They specialize in natives. Even got a section with potential bonsai trees. (bent, broken and damaged trees not suited for retail. Ideal for bonsai)
I recently imported some seeds that I germinated this season......Acacia xanthophloea and karroo, Red/Brown ivory, Bolusanthus speciosus, African olea, Celtis Africana, Mundelea sericea, Erythrina caffra to use as bonsai and to plant as trees here.
Have you seen Bolusanthus speciosus (Van Wyks hout) used as bonsai over there?
Another project I have is that of a Portulacaria afra (spekboom) i'm doing in a umbrella style. It has a 4 inch trunk and is 3 ft high. I have since planted it in the ground inside its pot (drilled some holes around the pot) because it grows exceptionally slowly in this colder weather. Its been planted in pure pumice for the last 3 years now. I have since drawn the branches down more and its ramification is also better. This is a older photo of it. Will post a newer one once I got my new phone sorted. It looks much better nowadays. It looks a bit boring from this angle but has good movement from other angles.  :D
« Last Edit: November 03, 2014, 09:27 PM by fredman »