Author Topic: Scots pine before and after  (Read 16813 times)

MatsuBonsai

  • John Callaway
  • Administrator
  • Hero Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1398
  • Thanked: 6 times
Scots pine before and after
« on: August 10, 2009, 08:13 PM »
I selected this Dwarf Scots Pine (Pinus sylvestris) as one of the trees to take for a weekend with Akio Kondo.  I have only had the tree about a year and had only repotted it to get it into good soil.  It had been grown for quite a while in a big nursery can in growers mix without repotting.  Once repotted this Spring it exploded with new growth, and was ready be worked.

Akio was a big help in deciding a direction for this tree.  John Kirby and I briefly discussed it while Akio worked on a big Ash Juniper.  We were initially thinking about making a much shorter tree than the final result.  I think Akio's choice of bringing a branch up to form a new apex was a much better choice.

It will grow another year in this pot, then into a Jim Gremel nanban pot, thanks to Dr. Kirby.

I asked Akio about a proper stand, when this is ready to show.  He said a 10" high stand would be good.  A slab would be too small/short for this tree.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2009, 09:09 PM by MatsuBonsai »
 

shimsuki

  • Sr. Forum Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 268
  • Thanked: 2 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2009, 07:42 PM »
Good work
 

AlexV

  • Full Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 128
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2009, 10:34 AM »
Hi John,

That is a pretty dramatic change.  I am wondering about the bottom left branch, I can't see it very well so I can't tell if it is coming out the side or back.  Either way, will you pull it around to make a pad on the left?  I have seen a couple pines with a similar profile and I really enjoy the look.  Good luck with this one!

Alex V
 

greerhw

  • Jr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2009, 05:30 PM »
Very nice pine and good work. Something that intrigues me though, myself included, will take any kind of pine and style it in the traditional JBP style, why is that. Is it that we secretly we want a JBP, but will use what we have and can afford to make  it resemble a JBP....

keep it green,
Harry
 

bonsaikc

  • Member
  • Sr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 330
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2009, 07:21 PM »
Very nice pine and good work. Something that intrigues me though, myself included, will take any kind of pine and style it in the traditional JBP style, why is that. Is it that we secretly we want a JBP, but will use what we have and can afford to make  it resemble a JBP....

keep it green,
Harry

Harry, I don't think this is styled as a Japanese black pine at all. It is styled like a pine. I'm not sure what I would call a "Japanese black pine style."

Chris
 

King Kong

  • Full Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
  • Banned
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2009, 07:56 PM »
Just a thought.......

__gary
 

MatsuBonsai

  • John Callaway
  • Administrator
  • Hero Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1398
  • Thanked: 6 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2009, 09:46 PM »
Hi John,

That is a pretty dramatic change.  I am wondering about the bottom left branch, I can't see it very well so I can't tell if it is coming out the side or back.  Either way, will you pull it around to make a pad on the left?  I have seen a couple pines with a similar profile and I really enjoy the look.  Good luck with this one!

Alex V


Alex,

Thanks for your comments.  This is actually a back branch that forks.  It was brought around quite a bit, but began to split at at the fork.  It will continue to be brought around a little bit more.  Once this is repotted (Spring 2011) into a more suitable pot and this new front I think it will look even better.  Keep in mind, this is just a first styling and should continue to improve through the years as work continues.
 

MatsuBonsai

  • John Callaway
  • Administrator
  • Hero Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1398
  • Thanked: 6 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2009, 09:54 PM »
Very nice pine and good work. Something that intrigues me though, myself included, will take any kind of pine and style it in the traditional JBP style, why is that. Is it that we secretly we want a JBP, but will use what we have and can afford to make  it resemble a JBP....

keep it green,
Harry


Harry,

Thanks for your comments.  I thought before, during, and after the work was complete it looked much more like a 5 needle pine to me.  From afar, Akio even asked initially if it were 5 needle as I brought it into the work area.

I'm curious now, what would you consider JBP style?  What would you suggest, or how would you style this tree differently?
 

MatsuBonsai

  • John Callaway
  • Administrator
  • Hero Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1398
  • Thanked: 6 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2009, 10:03 PM »
Just a thought.......

__gary


Gary,

Thanks for the virt.  This was about where I was initially thinking for this tree.  However, after seeing the finished product and imagining how the tree might fill in I think I prefer the taller tree.  Going shorter would take the gradual taper and quicken it right at the apex.  I like having options with more branches for future development.  There are so few branches in the "correct" places I would hate to remove any more at this point.  However, I won't rule it out for some point in the future.
 

greerhw

  • Jr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2009, 10:24 PM »
Your tree reminds me of a black pine, no problem, I would be proud to own it, White pine is another issue all together, they have a long main branch that bugs the hell out of me.

keep it green, Harry

 

greerhw

  • Jr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2009, 10:09 AM »
Very nice pine and good work. Something that intrigues me though, myself included, will take any kind of pine and style it in the traditional JBP style, why is that. Is it that we secretly we want a JBP, but will use what we have and can afford to make  it resemble a JBP....

keep it green,
Harry

Harry, I don't think this is styled as a Japanese black pine at all. It is styled like a pine. I'm not sure what I would call a "Japanese black pine style."

Chris























To me , it's a style when you see it,you know it.  I'm not knocking the tree, I think it turned out nice. Im giving you
MHO that's all.

keep it green,
Harry
 

MatsuBonsai

  • John Callaway
  • Administrator
  • Hero Forum Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1398
  • Thanked: 6 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2009, 11:10 AM »

To me , it's a style when you see it,you know it.  I'm not knocking the tree, I think it turned out nice. Im giving you
MHO that's all.

keep it green,
Harry

Harry,

I don't think anyone is accusing you of knocking the tree, I at least am trying to better understand your comments.  What is it that you see that makes this (and others) JBP style? 

In regards to your white pine comment, are you referring to the tree you pictured or all white pines?

Give us something more than, "you know it when you see it".
 

greerhw

  • Jr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2009, 01:21 PM »
It's like a beautiful woman, you know when you see her. The Japanese love to have one lower long branch on a JWP if possible, of course the majority aren't designed that way, I don't like to into a lot of detail when I type, it takes too much time with one finger. Your tree is the traditional triangle shape with the branches guy wired down, like it's been tortured by years of snow.

A few examples of the JWP style that is popular in Japan, I don't care for the design......

http://www.brusselsbonsai.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/japanese_five_needle_pine_specimen.html

keep it green,
Harry
« Last Edit: August 13, 2009, 01:59 PM by greerhw »
 

bonsaikc

  • Member
  • Sr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 330
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2009, 03:41 PM »
It's like a beautiful woman, you know when you see her. The Japanese love to have one lower long branch on a JWP if possible, of course the majority aren't designed that way, I don't like to into a lot of detail when I type, it takes too much time with one finger. Your tree is the traditional triangle shape with the branches guy wired down, like it's been tortured by years of snow.

A few examples of the JWP style that is popular in Japan, I don't care for the design......

http://www.brusselsbonsai.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/japanese_five_needle_pine_specimen.html

keep it green,
Harry

Harry, to be fair, those aren't very representative of good JWP bonsai. They are all grafted on wire-embedded JBP stock and a few may be "okay" bonsai but will always need that graft union hidden.

Chris
 

greerhw

  • Jr. Forum Member
  • **
  • Posts: 57
  • Thanked: 1 times
Re: Scots pine before and after
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2009, 04:51 PM »
Chris, do like the one I posted above, I could have bought it for 3k, it has a 7" trunk......
keep it green,
Harry
« Last Edit: August 13, 2009, 05:23 PM by greerhw »