Author Topic: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show  (Read 11374 times)

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #45 on: September 25, 2011, 10:59 AM »
Anyone??  I'm probably going to finish getting it wired today and would love to know anyone's thoughts on the two questions.
Thanks!
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #46 on: September 25, 2011, 03:13 PM »
Any more pictures after the wiring?
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #47 on: September 25, 2011, 04:44 PM »
Took this yesterday.  Thought it looked good till I uploaded it lol.  I got more done yesterday after this pic, and about to continue in awhile here.  I'll take a picture using flash this time if I have too.  So sorry for the crappy pic John.  I'll post some better ones tonight or tomorrow.
 

mcpesq817

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #48 on: September 26, 2011, 09:25 AM »
Looks like a pretty good start.  I'd leave it alone the rest of the year and let it recover, during which you can take more time to study the tree and figure out what direction you'd like to take with it.
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #49 on: September 26, 2011, 08:40 PM »
I've got the majority of the tree wired now.  Only two apex need to be wired.  I' need to take some pics of the present work, and when I'm finally finished.  Then I'll leave it as suggested mcpesq817.   I agree.  And then I can look forward toward spring and potting this tree in a proper Sara Rayner's pot.  And I have all winter to think of the planting angle.... ;)

John, I bought the BIB 2000-2004 book as I could afford this one lol  But it is great to see so many great bonsai, photographed so nicely, in one book.  Some great Hinoki Cypress' I've seen so far, just a 1/4 through the book.  Gives me inspiration, design ideas, and hope that I'll eventually have some beautiful trees myself!  I'll get one of those Kokufu Exhibition books eventually.  They look very nice too!  I see one could spend a small fortune on these books  ;)
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #50 on: September 26, 2011, 09:13 PM »
A nice plain background will do wonders. I usually find that I see more in photos than I do in person. Well, different maybe. Peter suggested closing one eye and trying to view it in 2d. I'm still trying to figure out the secret.

You can usually find a good used Kokufu book on eBay for around $50 still a little pricey, but a little more manageable than full price. I find the more recent ones show highly refined trees.

 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #51 on: September 27, 2011, 01:17 PM »
I'll get them shot in front of a white piece of cloth this time John.  Getting just the right background, lighting and perspective isn't as easy as it seems lol  (More rain today...ugh!)

And Thanks for the thought of Ebay for used Kokufu books....$50 a lot more affordable.  Great to know!

Let me ask, is it ok to bring a tree inside to work on it when it's cold out, or raining out?  And then back outside... Just not sure it's good for the tree to go from 58 to 72 for say 4 hrs, and then back out to the 58F.  Anyone do this?
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #52 on: September 28, 2011, 12:14 PM »
Ok, the rain let up enough for me to try my attempts at better photography.  The first is the front, second the side, and the third the back.  Still haven't had time to finish wiring apex's.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2011, 12:17 PM by Chrisl »
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #53 on: October 02, 2011, 01:50 PM »
Any thoughts?  I played around with different planting angles but didn't come to any conclusions.  It already has good trunk movement from the soil line so I'll prob. just leave it as is when I repot next year.  How about the photography?  Suggestions for improvement?
 

coh

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #54 on: October 03, 2011, 03:53 PM »
I'll take a stab. Keep in mind that I'm very new to bonsai and also to using photoshop, so these modified images/virts won't be very high quality.

First - the pictures with the simple white background are a big improvement. The issue I have with the photos is that it's hard to see the nebari/surface root structure. Maybe that is still buried in the soil? If not, a couple of pictures of that from different angles might help. The images seem a little dark, which may also be hiding some detail. I've tried to brighten them a little, and have posted one image below (attached image 2a)...seems to help a little. Also, you might want to get down a little lower when taking the photos, these seem to really be looking down at the tree and that can distort things. The general recommendation I've seen is to take the photo from about the level halfway between the surface and the first branch. Maybe others with more experience can offer more suggestions.

Second - I may have missed this earlier in the discussion, but which view do you anticipate to be the front? I'm assuming photo 1 or 2, most likely. If so...I'm wondering how you intend to handle the area where the trunk splits into 2 roughly equal sections? I'm guessing, based on the thickness, that those trunks probably are not really bendable. I find it somewhat distracting and think you might be fighting that as you design the tree. So maybe one of the other angles (something like 3, or its opposite view which isn't shown) would make that look better?

One option might be some major surgery to remove one of those trunks. I've taken photo 3 and removed first the left trunk to make a single trunk informal upright (image 2c), then removed the right trunk to make more of a literati style (image 2d). Again, keep in mind my inexperience here...and without seeing the tree in person it's tough to know if the branch structure would support something like either of these. Also I don't know if this species would do well as a literati.

Anyway, I don't know if this is any use, but it helps me to think about it.

Chris
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 04:04 PM by coh »
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #55 on: October 04, 2011, 09:34 PM »
Thanks Chris for any stab!  ;D  I appreciate any feedback. 

I thought the exposure was really good, but I think you're right, it could be a bit lighter.  Thanks for pointing that out. (though then you can see more of my crappy wiring job lol  I'm starting an intermediate bonsai class in two weeks, where I hope to learn how to apply it nicer, and without having to cross.)  However, working with annealed copper for the first time recently, I found myself doing it better strangely. This tree has alum, h. depot wire, and then I got the annealed copper and finished it out with that.  Much better!  ;D

There's not much nebari to speak of.  It's just badly in need of repotting with fine roots shooting out the surface.  Maybe there's something there deeper I'll find when I repot.

And yes, pic 1 is the anticipated front.  And actually, the trunks are quite flexible for the size.  Some 10g copper would prob. work, and I've/I'm considering it.  Do you not like the fact the two trunks split at the same level? (just trying to understand your critique). 
The second trunk spits into the trio which I like, but, if I guessed right about the trunk split, I tend to agree it's not a good feature of this tree.  I'll have to give it thought and play around a bit with different angles, and a white pillow case to cover up the L. branch against my 'new' white background.  lol   But anyway, as I looked at your virts, Thank You btw for doing those!, I'm not too keen on the literati style on this tree.  But the single trunk looks interesting.  I think I could pull that off by turning that L. branch into a jin, bend it to the left, and have the remaining R. trunk be the single trunk informal upright like in pic #1.  That might be interesting too. 
And Chris, I found your feedback very helpful, so again Thanks.

Chris
 

coh

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #56 on: October 04, 2011, 10:00 PM »
Hi Chris,

You know, it's hard to say exactly what it is about that trunk fork that bothers me. Maybe it's because it's been drummed into me that the "slingshot" or "Y" is not a good bonsai feature, so now I can't not see them! It's tough to be sure from a 2-d photo, you'll be in a much better position to judge since you've got the tree in front of you. But it looks like the 2 trunks are very similar in size/shape and kind of mirror each other most of the way up, which seems very static to me. I'm hoping someone more experienced might offer some thoughts. Have you tried posting the tree on any other forums? Best of course would be to get someone locally with more experience to look at the tree in person. Maybe I'm just off base...just doesn't seem like a natural tree shape that I'd see in nature (which I know isn't necessarily an issue in bonsai).

Definitely take your time with any major decisions like this...the pillowcase (or paper towel) trick is great. If you think you've figured it out, wait till Spring before cutting anything, just to be sure.

By the way, on the wiring...I haven't wired too many trees yet, but generally it seems that it's pretty much impossible to completely avoid any wire crossing on most trees (I base this on my own efforts plus looking at wiring done by more advanced artists around here). You certainly want to take your time and plan the wiring to keep it to a minimum, though...when I wired my first trees I wasn't really thinking and planning ahead and as a result wound up with a real mess. I'm getting better each time...

Chris
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #57 on: October 06, 2011, 02:16 PM »
Chris, no I haven't posted this on any other forum.  I maybe should as I'd prob. get more feedback.  But I really like this forum, is quiet, sane, and has some very knowledgable people.  Maybe I've burnt them out on this topic though ;D

Regarding the "Y", I had to spend sometime with the tree looking it over after reading this.  I have to admit, you're right.  The two trunks are pretty close together in girth.  The problem is, if I wanted to change it to an informal upright, the entire left side of the R. main trunk has nothing...same as the entire right side of the L. trunk has nothing.  And given this trees backbudding issues, I wonder if anything would grow back on the old wood.  I'll get some better pics and look it over this winter and go from there in the spring.  No rush as I'm sure the tree's had enough stress this year with my wiring.  (I too am getting better but still have the over tendency to wrap the wire too tight.  Working with the copper wire has helped though)

Thanks again Chris for sharing your thoughts!
Chris
 

MatsuBonsai

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #58 on: October 06, 2011, 02:21 PM »
The Y is a little high, but you might be able to work with it, if you shorten one of the trunks dramatically.  I like the virts.  I'm not sure how the bunjin would work, as the base looks a little heavy, in the virtual at least. 

You could wire branches to one side or another if you went with a single trunk.  Then there's always grafting.  I'm not sure you should count on buds on the trunk at this point.
 

Chrisl

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Re: My new acquisitions from the Midwest Show
« Reply #59 on: October 06, 2011, 03:03 PM »
Thanks Matsu for your opinion!  I too like the single trunk virt, no so much the bunjin.   Thanks for concurring on the lack of backbudding on the older wood.  I could do several approach grafts from the sacrificial trunk, I think it's a good idea.  Also the consideration of jinning out the sacrificial trunk afterwards to avoid a huge scar. 

Either way, I have to completely reconsider where I'm going with this one.  Obviously I didn't buy the best tree with this Y.  Something I knew, but didn't think of when buying this.  Lesson learned.   On the other hand, it's perhaps giving me the opportunity to try some different techniques I haven't tried yet....like the graft.