Bonsai Study Group Forum

Presentation => Bonsai Pot Discussion => Topic started by: suncrush on September 14, 2009, 09:00 AM

Title: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: suncrush on September 14, 2009, 09:00 AM
I won a neat Chinese elm in a raffle yesterday.  It's kind of a funky root-over rock rooted on a lava rock.

It already has a lot of chi and kwai, and it has a lot of potential for ching and ku, so I think it's a good candidate for a cool penjing.

I would like to do a land/water pot with it, but it's big.  I would need a land side that was about 12" X 10", and I can't find anyplace that sells them that big.  Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: Jeff Lahr on September 14, 2009, 11:08 AM
I am willing to expose my ignorance. What is "chi and kwai"?
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: suncrush on September 14, 2009, 12:56 PM
Sorry, Penjai terms.

"Ching" is purity of beauty.  A tree with good ching is instantly recognized as a piece of art.

"Chi" is spirit--the tree displays an ideal, concept, emotion or image in a unique and creative way.

"Ku" is age, sort of.  It's really a mix of old, venerable components and young components, like young shoots emerging from a gnarled, old trunk.

"Kwai" is like "wow factor." 

Great trees are strong examples of Chi, Ching, Ku and Kwai.

(This is how I was taught them.  I am not well versed in eastern philosophy, and I apologize if I misrepresent any of these concepts.)
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: rockm on September 15, 2009, 08:37 AM
Your vocabulary should include "Wabi," "Sabi" and "shibui." These concepts are more familiar to bonsaiists--and probably more applicable...
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: suncrush on September 15, 2009, 10:13 AM
Your vocabulary should include "Wabi," "Sabi" and "shibui." These concepts are more familiar to bonsaiists--and probably more applicable...

I would, but they are not the concepts I am trying for.  I am explicitly following Chinese aesthetic principles, not Japanese ones because I am trying to grow Chinese style trees.

I don't consider myself a bonsaiist; I consider myself a penzaiist.  It kind of makes me the impressionist in the Cubists' Club, but that's ok with me.  :)

Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: rockm on September 15, 2009, 12:41 PM
You're posting on "Bonsai" website...The terms you're using are mostly unfamiliar to us--at least to me anyway and I've been doing bonsai and "pensai" 'penjing', pent'zai, for almost 20 years. Of course you can use them. Didn't mean to imply otherwise. I was just pointing out more understandable terms that are more commonly used by bonsaiists might be easier to get a response/reaction to...


Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: suncrush on September 15, 2009, 12:59 PM
You're posting on "Bonsai" website...The terms you're using are mostly unfamiliar to us--at least to me anyway and I've been doing bonsai and "pensai" 'penjing', pent'zai, for almost 20 years. Of course you can use them. Didn't mean to imply otherwise. I was just pointing out more understandable terms that are more commonly used by bonsaiists might be easier to get a response/reaction to...

Fair enough.

Back on topic, does anyone have a suggestion for a pot?
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: rockm on September 15, 2009, 01:31 PM
If you're a penjing fan, you probably know that simple rimmed flat "suibans" are used to make classic land/water penjing. The land area is built up and separated from the "water" area (which is just empty space suggesting water). Split pots that hold water and soil wind up being a mess and can look clunky.

Here's a link to a notable land/water artist's work-
http://www.artofbonsai.org/galleries/zhao.php (http://www.artofbonsai.org/galleries/zhao.php)

Note that a simple flat durable surface--the slabs there are marble, but ceramic slabs are easily built (or bought).

Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: suncrush on September 15, 2009, 04:27 PM
Yeah, actually, I think that is the way to go.
Title: Re: Need a BIG Land/Water Pot
Post by: Dale Cochoy on September 22, 2009, 04:27 PM
Got a picture?
Dale